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Frant
King's Bounty
Posts: 24650
Location: Your Mom
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 Posted: Mon, 24th Nov 2008 04:14 Post subject: |
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| dakiller wrote: | | Frant wrote: | PC gaming isn't dying or going to die. The simple fact is that there are still millions with PC's that want to play games, thus the market for PC gaming is there. We're currently in a transition phase (no idea how long it will last though) where practices, cross-platform development and other structural changes aren't optimal for the market. Part of this is due to consoles. It's a completely different market and publishers have better projections and statistics to guide them when it comes to planning projects. That's why there's a tendency to copy that strategy to the PC market, and we're stuck in the middle because the PC market isn't 1:1 compatible with the strategy of console development.
People tend to treat this subject with emotions instead of logic and common sense. If there's people willing to buy games for PC you'll have publishers and developers willing to develop games for us. We're just in the middle of a global financial crisis, big publishers are changing their mode of operation, developers have a hard time doing what they want since they have to conform to the wishes of the publishers. Things will change (and we're in the middle of that change now which is why everyone is so worried). |
A well thought out reply,
i would agree with others in this thread that innovation is driven by vid card/ CPU tech...and that is in turn driven by more demanding apps...not just games
PC gaming is not dying
its a matter of weeding out the button mashing fodder that of course don't require a sophisticated input system (ie KB/Mouse) |
I forgot to bring the aspect of GPU's/CPU's into my post. nVidia, AMD/ATI, Creative, Intel, name-any-vendor-selling-gfx, they need PC gaming even more than we do. It's why they keep building and researching ever faster and more advanced parts, and it's what makes them survive.
For the sake of the argument, let's compare how much nVidia/AMD makes from console users vs PC gamers. When people buy a console, they pay a one-time fee for the hardware, and the price of the GPU in a console isn't even close to that of a discreet gfx-card in the mid-high range. Meanwhile PC gamers replace their hardware fairly regular (annually, or bi-annually at the very least). We keep paying them, and they keep improving and manufacturing new cards that we will also buy.
Add to that the latest trend of GPGPU applications becoming widespread and more important whether it's for game physics, media conversion, scientific calculations etc. Even DirectX11 will have Compute Shaders, enabling GPGPU tasks on all DX11-compatible hardware regardless of who makes it. I see exciting times ahead.
There's also the approach iD Software is taking with iD Tech 5, making it truly cross platform while being completely transparent to the game developers. Tools, asset creation etc. will work on top of the Tech without the need to tailor everything for a specific platform. This will hopefully mean that future cross platform games will be of much higher quality (no sloppy ports, we really don't want them, they're an insult to every PC gamer).
Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn!
"The sky was the color of a TV tuned to a dead station" - Neuromancer
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| Posted: Mon, 24th Nov 2008 04:59 Post subject: |
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Pc will never die as gamming platform.In fact it´s the only platform that keep going.
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| Posted: Mon, 24th Nov 2008 05:04 Post subject: |
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| Frant wrote: | | dakiller wrote: | | Frant wrote: | PC gaming isn't dying or going to die. The simple fact is that there are still millions with PC's that want to play games, thus the market for PC gaming is there. We're currently in a transition phase (no idea how long it will last though) where practices, cross-platform development and other structural changes aren't optimal for the market. Part of this is due to consoles. It's a completely different market and publishers have better projections and statistics to guide them when it comes to planning projects. That's why there's a tendency to copy that strategy to the PC market, and we're stuck in the middle because the PC market isn't 1:1 compatible with the strategy of console development.
People tend to treat this subject with emotions instead of logic and common sense. If there's people willing to buy games for PC you'll have publishers and developers willing to develop games for us. We're just in the middle of a global financial crisis, big publishers are changing their mode of operation, developers have a hard time doing what they want since they have to conform to the wishes of the publishers. Things will change (and we're in the middle of that change now which is why everyone is so worried). |
A well thought out reply,
i would agree with others in this thread that innovation is driven by vid card/ CPU tech...and that is in turn driven by more demanding apps...not just games
PC gaming is not dying
its a matter of weeding out the button mashing fodder that of course don't require a sophisticated input system (ie KB/Mouse) |
I forgot to bring the aspect of GPU's/CPU's into my post. nVidia, AMD/ATI, Creative, Intel, name-any-vendor-selling-gfx, they need PC gaming even more than we do. It's why they keep building and researching ever faster and more advanced parts, and it's what makes them survive.
For the sake of the argument, let's compare how much nVidia/AMD makes from console users vs PC gamers. When people buy a console, they pay a one-time fee for the hardware, and the price of the GPU in a console isn't even close to that of a discreet gfx-card in the mid-high range. Meanwhile PC gamers replace their hardware fairly regular (annually, or bi-annually at the very least). We keep paying them, and they keep improving and manufacturing new cards that we will also buy.
Add to that the latest trend of GPGPU applications becoming widespread and more important whether it's for game physics, media conversion, scientific calculations etc. Even DirectX11 will have Compute Shaders, enabling GPGPU tasks on all DX11-compatible hardware regardless of who makes it. I see exciting times ahead.
There's also the approach iD Software is taking with iD Tech 5, making it truly cross platform while being completely transparent to the game developers. Tools, asset creation etc. will work on top of the Tech without the need to tailor everything for a specific platform. This will hopefully mean that future cross platform games will be of much higher quality (no sloppy ports, we really don't want them, they're an insult to every PC gamer). |
High end hardware sells nothing compare to budget and mainstream hardware. You know who ships the most graphic units? Intel. That's right. Integrated graphics. By nearly double the competitors.
PC sales were actually up recently. The problem? They were all budget wal mart computers in a box.
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| Posted: Mon, 24th Nov 2008 12:36 Post subject: |
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| Sin317 wrote: |
as marked above, you clearly said "in medium" and thats what my argument was based upon. For 1000$ , you get a highend pc these days, if you know how to buy properly. |
Is medium in 6months and old in 18 anzwaz. its still the same. 600$ more then next gen console.
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Neon
VIP Member
Posts: 18935
Location: Poland
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| Posted: Mon, 24th Nov 2008 16:25 Post subject: |
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I have bought my PC almost 2 years ago and I still can run most games on highest details with little or no framerate hiccups
So freakshow,your argument is ass.
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| Posted: Mon, 24th Nov 2008 16:42 Post subject: |
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| Neon25 wrote: | I have bought my PC almost 2 years ago and I still can run most games on highest details with little or no framerate hiccups
So freakshow,your argument is ass. |
I agree. If u have a gaming PC now that can play all the ports at better gfx than the consoles, there will be no 'need' to upgrade until the next gen consoles appear.
Ryzen 5 5600, ASUS ROG STRIX B550-F GAMING WIFI II, Corsair Vengeance RGB RT 32GB 3600MHz C16, MSI RTX 5070 Ti Ventus 3X OC , Corsair RMx Series RM750x. AOC AGON AG324UX - 4K 144Hz 1ms
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Sin317
Banned
Posts: 24322
Location: Geneva
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| Posted: Tue, 25th Nov 2008 11:05 Post subject: |
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| rhagz wrote: | And if online distribution was that big do you think we would be stuck with D2D and Steam and that's it? Companies would be scrambling to jump on the bandwagon. As it is, it takes a miracle to get a non-Valve game on Steam.
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HELLOOOOO!!! WAKE UP!!!
Almost every freaking major title that came out this fall was available in digital form from one distributor or the other. Sure you might still have a few that you cant get digitally, but luckily that number decreases every day. Even if its not available digitally right from the start, one of the major players will make sure to get their hands on it within a few weeks of its launch.
So what exactly are we talking about?
DD is slowly but surely taking over and moving ahead, which is a really good thing in my eyes.
As for sale stats: do you think valve are stupid? If they would release proud reports how they kick everyone's ass with their DD, they would only create incentive for competitors to start up their own DD service essentially cutting their own profits. Why do you think are there no clear reports of steam's success rate?
I can tell you this: i have plenty of friends who rarely every bought a game before DD, but since steam was launched they buy games that come out of it pretty regularly. Hell.. i myself own way more DD titles than boxed ones, and when i say way more, i mean like5x or more.
Now if that small pattern is just an indicator of whats going on all around the world, then we can safely say, that DD might indeed rock, although its unlikely we will ever get confirmation of that..
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