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tobycoaster
Harry Potter
Posts: 598
Location: Under the stairs
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 Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 00:25 Post subject: |
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| Serben wrote: | | kaeye wrote: | The majourity IS black youths serben. You dont fucking live here, so please try it for a week then 'educate your mind' and clear off.
Theres a page on the BBC news site somewhere of all the youths killed by knife crime this year and something like 17 / 19 are black/mixed asian black. The ones who have their attackers caught are all blacks.
The problem doesnt stem that far out of London from what we hear anyway. Nottingham has the same problem but no where near the same scale, am I right Geordie?
Imo the day we had to have metal detectors built into school entrances was the day it went to shit. This country is fucked. |
Oh do shut the fuck up. I live in one of the most crime infested areas of my city. There are gangbangers all over the place here, and a lot of them are not above beating you down in the street just for looking at them. Most of them are indeed ethnic minorities, but that's because 90% of the population in my area is made up of non-Swedes. There are just as many Swedes here per capita who are involved in crime. It's just that they make up a much smaller portion of the population here, so it seems as if only the minorities are criminals. But you can't just look at one small area as you apparently are doing. I'm assuming you're basing your so called "facts" on what you see in your own area? Well guess what, that doesn't mean shit. You have to collect statistics nationwide and across all segments of society, otherwise you don't get an accurate picture. And it's also like nouse said. You're probably more likely to notice when a black person does something than when a white person does something, because you want to belive in the superiority of your own race. So you tend to ignore when a white person does something. The point is, however, that until you've personally conducted a nationwide statistical analysis, your opinion doesn't count for shit. |
Serben u misunderstand yet again ( whats with all the u r a racsit comments all the time) The UK knife crime epedemic is predominatly black on black crime , racists didnt invent the headlines its just the way it is ALL OVER the uk.
Now please get off your soap box and discuss it properly
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 01:07 Post subject: |
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I blame the dumb british press, they end up glamourising stuff like this. Feeble minded and thick uneducated kids are impressed by pictures and stories of this sort of thing they read in the Sun and the News of the World.
This is a unigue problem in the UK which the tabloid press seem either to refuse to see or are simply completely maipulative and synical. Stories like knife crime although occuring, become like cheap horror stories over your cornflakes.
If they excepted some responsibility, they wouldn't report these sad stories in quite the same salacious way.
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SycoShaman
VIP Master Jedi
Posts: 24468
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 08:16 Post subject: |
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| tobycoaster wrote: | | Serben wrote: | | kaeye wrote: | The majourity IS black youths serben. You dont fucking live here, so please try it for a week then 'educate your mind' and clear off.
Theres a page on the BBC news site somewhere of all the youths killed by knife crime this year and something like 17 / 19 are black/mixed asian black. The ones who have their attackers caught are all blacks.
The problem doesnt stem that far out of London from what we hear anyway. Nottingham has the same problem but no where near the same scale, am I right Geordie?
Imo the day we had to have metal detectors built into school entrances was the day it went to shit. This country is fucked. |
Oh do shut the fuck up. I live in one of the most crime infested areas of my city. There are gangbangers all over the place here, and a lot of them are not above beating you down in the street just for looking at them. Most of them are indeed ethnic minorities, but that's because 90% of the population in my area is made up of non-Swedes. There are just as many Swedes here per capita who are involved in crime. It's just that they make up a much smaller portion of the population here, so it seems as if only the minorities are criminals. But you can't just look at one small area as you apparently are doing. I'm assuming you're basing your so called "facts" on what you see in your own area? Well guess what, that doesn't mean shit. You have to collect statistics nationwide and across all segments of society, otherwise you don't get an accurate picture. And it's also like nouse said. You're probably more likely to notice when a black person does something than when a white person does something, because you want to belive in the superiority of your own race. So you tend to ignore when a white person does something. The point is, however, that until you've personally conducted a nationwide statistical analysis, your opinion doesn't count for shit. |
Serben u misunderstand yet again ( whats with all the u r a racsit comments all the time) The UK knife crime epedemic is predominatly black on black crime , racists didnt invent the headlines its just the way it is ALL OVER the uk.
Now please get off your soap box and discuss it properly |
I like kae and serben and both make valid arguements.
But saying serben uses racial slurs is just not true. If there is one person on here who is anti racism, antidisestablishment, equal rights for all etc its him. |
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 08:51 Post subject: |
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| SycoShaman wrote: | | tobycoaster wrote: | | Serben wrote: |
Oh do shut the fuck up. I live in one of the most crime infested areas of my city. There are gangbangers all over the place here, and a lot of them are not above beating you down in the street just for looking at them. Most of them are indeed ethnic minorities, but that's because 90% of the population in my area is made up of non-Swedes. There are just as many Swedes here per capita who are involved in crime. It's just that they make up a much smaller portion of the population here, so it seems as if only the minorities are criminals. But you can't just look at one small area as you apparently are doing. I'm assuming you're basing your so called "facts" on what you see in your own area? Well guess what, that doesn't mean shit. You have to collect statistics nationwide and across all segments of society, otherwise you don't get an accurate picture. And it's also like nouse said. You're probably more likely to notice when a black person does something than when a white person does something, because you want to belive in the superiority of your own race. So you tend to ignore when a white person does something. The point is, however, that until you've personally conducted a nationwide statistical analysis, your opinion doesn't count for shit. |
Serben u misunderstand yet again ( whats with all the u r a racsit comments all the time) The UK knife crime epedemic is predominatly black on black crime , racists didnt invent the headlines its just the way it is ALL OVER the uk.
Now please get off your soap box and discuss it properly |
I like kae and serben and both make valid arguements.
But saying serben uses racial slurs is just not true. If there is one person on here who is anti racism, antidisestablishment, equal rights for all etc its him. |
Ok, he might be anti racism etc but there is a difference in being anti racist and insisting that others are racist.
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SycoShaman
VIP Master Jedi
Posts: 24468
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 08:54 Post subject: |
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I dont think he was saying kae was racist and I know kae isnt racist.
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 10:10 Post subject: |
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He said I was, and I can assure you i'm not. Just because I think one section of society is responsible for a certain thing, doesn't mean that I utterly hate them altogether.
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Cohen
Posts: 7155
Location: Rapture
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SycoShaman
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Posts: 24468
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 10:48 Post subject: |
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| GeordieRacer wrote: | | He said I was, and I can assure you i'm not. Just because I think one section of society is responsible for a certain thing, doesn't mean that I utterly hate them altogether. |
Im not saying your racist or anything man but the way your post came across, it did sound like you were being a bit racist.
How would feel if a black british person came on here and emphatically emphasized that white british youths were commiting crimes? wouldnt that offend you a bit?
Again, Im not saying your racist, im just trying to make you see how it could come across looking as if you were |
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 10:59 Post subject: |
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If I thought that he had a case then I'd agree, if he didnt then i'd probably be more inclined to ask why he thinks this, I don't think I'd call him racist though, it's quite a bold statement. I'm merely stating that my perception of current knife crime in the UK is based upon what I hear and what I have read.
Careful Kaeye. I know he's annoying, hes not worth getting banned for though.
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Cohen
Posts: 7155
Location: Rapture
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 11:41 Post subject: |
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Ive not said anything worthy of a ban, Ive just defended myself against his typical mindless *YOUR A RACIST!* crap once again. It's because of his childish quirks that Jenni doesnt post here anymore. I for one wont stand for his rallying.
troll detected by SiN
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SycoShaman
VIP Master Jedi
Posts: 24468
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 11:51 Post subject: |
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Isnt there some kinda common ground you guys can come to? I know Serben isnt a racist and I know Kae isnt a racist. I dont see why both of you are arguing.
And Geordie, Im not saying your racist, its just i dont know you as well as I know Kae and Serb so I cant say with certainty whether or not your racist. So no disrespect intended mate
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 12:02 Post subject: |
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| Serben wrote: | | What really causes crime is pverty. |
And the feeling of being ignored by the state. /thread
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 12:04 Post subject: |
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And yeah, I'm with Serben on this one.
I also think fisk should be unbanned.
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 12:04 Post subject: |
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I know you're not calling me racist dude, and i'm not taking any offence. Just as soon as someone brings up anything to do with race, Serben pops up with, 'you're a racist'. I'm not a racist, I know i'm not a racist and I don't particularly like being called one.
I may be misinformed on this knife crime issue, and if someone were to provide the hard evidence id be the first one to hold my hands up and say I'm wrong, however it's difficult to think otherwise when all you hear and read is black person stabbed, youth dies from knife attack etc etc.
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Cohen
Posts: 7155
Location: Rapture
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 12:17 Post subject: |
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| dominae wrote: | | And yeah, I'm with Serben on this one. |
you always are because you can do nothing but bandwagon ride instead of putting across a good arguement, and you have a vendetta against the good mod here just like he has because this is not your first account, is it.
I hate dishonesty and stupidity so much.
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 12:22 Post subject: |
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Ok, maybe poverty does come into it a bit right, but how many gangs of youths do you think think 'oh, the government is ignoring me so i'll carry a knife' they do it because they are in rivalry with eachother. They're striving to be top dog.
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 12:31 Post subject: |
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I love how this issue gets derailed by (unjust) accusations of racism while the real problem doesn't get the attention it deserves. And I am not talking just nfohump. I mean over-representation of minorities in crime statistics shouldn't even be a point of discussion given the range of statistics available.
Some time back a bunch of people from zimbabwe got slaughtered in south africa but it was business as usual since both parties were black and the issue was filed under xenophobia. But where there are different races involved it becomes very touchy and it's far too easy for people to divert attention from the real problems.
The real issues as I see them are:
1. Gangs are on the rise.
2. There are black gangs and white gangs and brown gangs.
3. A large number of victims and perpetrators of knife incidents are black.
These events should be enough to alarm most people but we tend to get fixated on people wanting statistics and there's nothing wrong with that. But once those statistics are presented people start disputing the accuracy, underlying reasons, etc, etc instead of getting on with the job.
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 12:59 Post subject: |
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What you need is a couple of ex military guys carrying pistols fitted with silencers. Then walk around these neighbourhoods posing as bait. If these assholes approach and try to slice you up just blow their brains out and vanish. If they don't carry weapons shoot their kneecaps. Eitherway problem solved in a week.
I would do this in every neighbourhood where bastards living there think they own it. Send a black man into a white zone ful of chavs and a white dude into black ghetto. That would cut down on racism and crime.
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Cohen
Posts: 7155
Location: Rapture
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 14:00 Post subject: |
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LOL.
Sounds like some kind of *set the world right* Edvard Munch style
troll detected by SiN
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frno
Posts: 99
Location: uk
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 14:36 Post subject: |
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 17:30 Post subject: |
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| Serben wrote: | | What really causes crime is pverty. |
Sorry but your wrong. Most people in poverty aren't criminals therefor the majority of crime could not be excused by poverty. In fact that line of thinking is pretty offensive.
This would also fail to explain why people of the middle class and high class commit crimes.
I am considered in poverty as I am in a family of 3 and make less than $17,600 a year. I'm not going around committing crimes.
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nouseforaname
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Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 19:40 Post subject: |
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Poverty does not cause crime. It simply changes the type of criminal acts. Poor people steal TVs, rob stores etc. Rich people cheat on taxes, start wars in Iraq and cheat you out of your pension.
From my point of view rich peoples crime is far worse. A drug dealer on the corner could probably be blamed for the death of 10 people but a rich fucker with connections and influence could probably be blamed for the death of 100s.
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nouseforaname
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Posts: 21306
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 19:48 Post subject: |
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The willingness to commit a crime increases the less you have to lose / the less you think you will get caught.
You're missing a big chunk of violent crime in your assessment. Also consider something like spousal abuse:
| Quote: | Risk markers for spousal abuse include:
* an unemployed male
* a male who uses illegal drugs
* males and females with different religious backgrounds
* a male who saw his father hit his mother
* male and female unmarried cohabitants
* males with blue-collar occupations
* males who did not graduate from high school
* males between eighteen and thirty years of age
* males or females who use severe violence toward children in the home
* total family income below the poverty level
(...) the researchers found that abused women do not differ in specific personality traits from women who are not abused in terms of age, educational level, race, occupational status, length of time in the relationship, or number of children. Furthermore, a woman's poor self-esteem did not appear to be a risk factor but rather a consequence of abuse.
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http://www.libraryindex.com/pages/2050/Causes-Wife-Abuse-SIGNS-POTENTIAL-VIOLENCE.html
asus z170-A || core i5-6600K || geforce gtx 970 4gb || 16gb ddr4 ram || win10 || 1080p led samsung 27"
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nouseforaname
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Posts: 21306
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Wed, 16th Jul 2008 23:26 Post subject: |
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the problem is that this is something established by statistics and countless studies since the 60s.
| Quote: | | With few exceptions, there also seems to be a strong correlation between median household income and crime rates. |
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_the_United_States
there are further links within that wiki article. notice they say crime rate meaning population size has been taken into account. I mean, a rich person doesn't break into someone's house (risking death probably in a gated community) to steal a TV and then sell it for 20% of the value.
now, most people anywhere regardless of anything are NOT criminals, so you should never pre-judge someone based on income/race/whatever. if I can offer another comparison ... "not all muslims are terrorists, but certainly most terrorists are muslim." to paraphrase something another dude said.
asus z170-A || core i5-6600K || geforce gtx 970 4gb || 16gb ddr4 ram || win10 || 1080p led samsung 27"
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| Posted: Fri, 18th Jul 2008 09:10 Post subject: |
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| Posted: Fri, 18th Jul 2008 10:48 Post subject: |
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| nouseforaname wrote: | | "not all muslims are terrorists, but certainly most terrorists are muslim." |
I wonder if it was an american who said it.
Now, according to statistics "terrorism" has increased vastly since 2005, and from several interviews and reports from "the other side", many of the ex-Iraq military get paid money to wage "Insurgent war", their motive is that their homelands are being invaded by westerners and many of them see it as a ratified war.
The definition of terrorism is interesting as well, if you are losing a war, if you have no tactical advantage - and you cannot surrender because it means to be assimilated into someone elses culture, people resort to extreme measures. Psychological warfare becomes a factor. And terror is the key psychological motivator. For instance, in the Vietnam war - when the americans were losing snipers used to shoot the first man in a marching line, this was done every time and this led to no one wanting to be first in line, and demoralized soldiers incredibly.
Now naturally this is not viewed as terrorism. But it is of tactical value. Today we view terrorism as the wanton slaughter of innocents, but USA kill innocents too. Dozens of them, bombs dropped on hospitals, children being shot by american snipers, etc. - these deaths are called collateral damage. And the excuse is that "we did not intend to shoot innocents" ... well, as the saying goes the road to hell is paved with good intentions.
It is of course natural to make the enemy into a demon, dehumanize him. Think of him as without emotions, evil and without family. Someone who is without reason and rationale. It's done by any warring faction throughout history, and it's done by western media to the point that people honestly believe that there is a little terrorist living in every muslim; whether he admits it or not. Western media is so effective at duping the masses that it even succeeds to the point of making otherwise sane critical thinkers to just buy into the rhetoric. For after all, why sympathize with "them"? Even the word "terrorism" is a strong rhetoric - because terrorists don't play by the rules.
When the soviet union engaged Finland in what were to become one of the most hard fought wars in the history of the nation, Talvisota. The Fins were outnumbered and outgunned. Swedish strategists said that Finland should capitulate and officially refused to help them. The Fins instead used "horrible weapons" (from the soviet viewpoint), flasks full of burning fire that later became known as the Molotov coctail (also one of the most used weapons in so-called "Freedom fighting" later in history). But to the soviets it was terrorism. These Fins did not engage them in battle, they used ski's, and sneaked onto tanks and burned the soviets alive inside. And managed to destroy the soviets despite they had a vastly superior logistic support and tanks and soldiers. But the soviets did not at the time see it as a legitimate war, they claimed it was terrorism.
So effective to use that word, isn't it? One word and suddenly the enemies are demons without brains, some brainwashed "raghead", intent on spreading evil and Islam over the world.
Oh, the folly of the ignorant is not that they refuse to see. It is that they fear what they do not comprehend.
This is also, ultimately why people rather become racists and rather look at ethnicity than any other factors. They are like the German scientists who noticed that for some reason there was a drop in childbirth during what later became known as "the depression" and correlated it to "fewer storks".
If you do not understand the analogy, I'll make it even clearer.
No one who feels comfortable and welcome in a habitat will seek to express discomfort. Whether they or their parents are born there or not.
If you don't understand that one, then I'm at a loss. Keep on being afraid.[/url]
I also think fisk should be unbanned.
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deelix
PDIP Member
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Location: Norway
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Cohen
Posts: 7155
Location: Rapture
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