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vurt
Posts: 14372
Location: Sweden
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 Posted: Mon, 15th Jun 2026 22:42 Post subject: |
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sucks that Fable was taken away, it was truly awesome. people one-shotting minecraft, call of duty and a lot of other games, really insane. its not just twice as good as AI was a year a go, its like 100's of times better.
i was lucky enough to be able to use it for a few days though, did some awesome tools with it + made it do a really great claude.md file (instructions for other AI's).
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| Posted: Tue, 16th Jun 2026 00:50 Post subject: |
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How much did you spend on it while it was available?
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vurt
Posts: 14372
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Tue, 16th Jun 2026 04:35 Post subject: |
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I have the Pro plan, so 22.50 euro / month, i do not add additional tokens.
It gets expensive though, i also have Google AI Pro and ChatGPT Plus, around the same price / each.
But whatever, having a blast with it, making my dream tools and the game i am doing has expanded a lot in these last 2 weeks.
I do not spend hundreds or thousands of dollars on it which there definitely is people who do. If i was rich i 100% would.
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vurt
Posts: 14372
Location: Sweden
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DXWarlock
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Location: Florida, USA
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| Posted: Tue, 16th Jun 2026 06:43 Post subject: |
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| vurt wrote: | Building apps and understanding more of UI etc it angers me more and more how immensely poorly designed many apps are that i am using for AI;
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So it's not only me!
My biggest one is ``` code.
Sometimes you can click out of it to type after.
Sometimes you can't.
Sometimes another ``` closes it.
Sometimes ENTER closes it, OTHER times it just adds empty lines in the code box and can't click under it.
 Spoiler: | |
-We don't control what happens to us in life, but we control how we respond to what happens in life.
-Hard times create strong men, strong men create good times, good times create weak men, and weak men create hard times. -G. Michael Hopf
Disclaimer: Post made by me are of my own creation. A delusional mind relayed in text form.
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LeoNatan
☢ NFOHump Despot ☢
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| Posted: Tue, 16th Jun 2026 07:14 Post subject: |
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DXWarlock
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Location: Florida, USA
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| Posted: Tue, 16th Jun 2026 08:08 Post subject: |
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LLM is AI.
-We don't control what happens to us in life, but we control how we respond to what happens in life.
-Hard times create strong men, strong men create good times, good times create weak men, and weak men create hard times. -G. Michael Hopf
Disclaimer: Post made by me are of my own creation. A delusional mind relayed in text form.
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vurt
Posts: 14372
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Tue, 16th Jun 2026 08:19 Post subject: |
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| DXWarlock wrote: | | vurt wrote: | Building apps and understanding more of UI etc it angers me more and more how immensely poorly designed many apps are that i am using for AI;
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So it's not only me!
My biggest one is ``` code.
Sometimes you can click out of it to type after.
Sometimes you can't.
Sometimes another ``` closes it.
Sometimes ENTER closes it, OTHER times it just adds empty lines in the code box and can't click under it.
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There certainly are more annoyances than needed, that's for sure. Apps are often way sloppier made than games. I would be so ashamed of myself i had done a crap job of UI + knowing thousands of people are annoyed hourly when they are using it, year after year. And its a 30 second fix to make it all go away. like lol...
Photoshop is a SHIT user experience. I am so glad i can use my own image tool now and never touch PS again more than perhaps for some rare functions that i sometimes use.
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zenux
Posts: 2972
Location: lɘɒɿƨI
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| Posted: Tue, 16th Jun 2026 13:32 Post subject: |
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| LeoNatan wrote: | | LLM is not AI. |
AI is not AGI.
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| Posted: Tue, 16th Jun 2026 17:16 Post subject: |
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i dont think ai porn is at the quake1 stage ... they at the quake4 regression stage lol so crap vids popping up all over the place
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LeoNatan
☢ NFOHump Despot ☢
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| Posted: Tue, 16th Jun 2026 18:42 Post subject: |
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| zenux wrote: | | LeoNatan wrote: | | LLM is not AI. |
AI is not AGI. |
What's the difference?
I say, when you've reached intelligence, you've reached "general" intelligence. LLM is not that. |
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zenux
Posts: 2972
Location: lɘɒɿƨI
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| Posted: Tue, 16th Jun 2026 19:06 Post subject: |
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@LeoNatan
I think today's definition of AI is not what it used to be decades ago before neural networks or even right before chatGPT's emergence. LLMs have been passing the Turing test for quite some time now, rendering this test obsolete. A new test should be developed for recognising AGI whether it's even possible.
I reckon, when you say AI, you mean that old definition of AI, which is now called AGI.
Last edited by zenux on Tue, 16th Jun 2026 19:09; edited 1 time in total
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DXWarlock
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| Posted: Tue, 16th Jun 2026 19:09 Post subject: |
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@LeoNatan
Are you using g-factor to measure an entity that is not human? 'Reaching intelligence' is NOT the same as reaching GI. Otherwise, we need to rewrite what 'intelligence' means for things like: crows, dolphins, elephants, pigs, and chimps.
You are smashing two totally separate metrics into one, trying to set a bar made of both. And applying the lower limit of intelligence using a human-specific metric, when being deemed intelligent in and of itself can be way broader than specifically that.
You are trying to merge 'perceived intelligence' with 'human equivalent intelligence'. A thing doesn't need human levels of intelligence to be deemed intelligent (like those animals are).
Once again, I agree that current AI is not intelligent in any current metric we use, G-based or not. But please...stop trying to help the argument that current AI is not truly intelligent. You are hurting the cause.
-We don't control what happens to us in life, but we control how we respond to what happens in life.
-Hard times create strong men, strong men create good times, good times create weak men, and weak men create hard times. -G. Michael Hopf
Disclaimer: Post made by me are of my own creation. A delusional mind relayed in text form.
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LeoNatan
☢ NFOHump Despot ☢
Posts: 75008
Location: Israel
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| Posted: Tue, 16th Jun 2026 21:53 Post subject: |
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"Intelligence", like all language we use, is rooted in our understanding of what "intelligence" is in humans. My dog has intelligence, such as it is, but she is not as intelligent as a human being, even one that posts on NFOhump. So this is my standard for "intelligence" when applied to "AI". LLM offers no intelligence, so it doesn't matter if you are talking about "crow intelligence" or "elephant intelligence", as LLM has none.
Even attempts at "standardized" "objective" testing of intelligence, such as IQ, is a subjective attempt to grade what intelligence was perceived as at the time of its conception and various revisions. An ape can also be graded on this scale, with results that resemble a Trump human being, for example. I'm sure "crows, dolphins, elephants, pigs" can also be placed on that "standard" "objective" scale. (The test is obviously flawed since it can be gamed, influenced by state of mind, such as anxiety, etc.)
Notice I am not arguing whether LLM has utility, although I do see it as overblown in some aspects. That has never been my argument, at least not in recent years. My tilting at mills here is with the use of the term "intelligence" as we understand it, of which LLM has none, just as a calculator, whose utility is undeniable and indisputable, has none. Neural networks also have no intelligence, but have utility.
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DXWarlock
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| Posted: Tue, 16th Jun 2026 23:48 Post subject: |
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| LeoNatan wrote: | | "Intelligence", like all language we use, is rooted in our understanding of what "intelligence" is in humans. |
Yes. Same thing I said. But the key is rooted in, not based on.
And your argument was not that. It was that (in essence) it's not comparable to our specific level of intelligence.
At least your framing of it is very specific to one creature, and one metric we use on that one, and how it is not that.
I am not arguing that it's wrong, it doesn't have that, it's not. I am saying the gauge you are using to see when it meets that threshold is wrong for WHEN it will have it.
Im not retorting that it has it. It doesn't even have self-autonomy of agency yet. Even a simple multicelled biolife has that. Now that doesn't mean they are intelligent. But it is a requirement on the list of things that are required to be able to emerge intelligence. If you are missing that, you cannot skip it and go to eventually intelligent while still missing that part.
And also, metacognition is a LONG way off from its traits. That's a core foundation of signs of intelligence.
Edit: had to go find the other I could not remember: Self-modeling. (Not in the AI term of model, but behavioral). internalization of oneself, and your persistent existence as a being, that ponders and adjusts your mental 'framework' from that viewpoint. Even more animals have this.
I am responding to your checklist of what it needs to eventually be to pass, is too high. Some of the things you mention that it needs in past posts, intelligent creatures dont even have. Why would it need those to get awarded the same medal?
So maybe we are agreeing? I just say your bottom criteria (at least how I understand your phrasing in your past posts). Is a level that is so high, it WOULD have intelligence on some qualitative level, before it hits your requirements.
We both agree it's not. We disagree on 'when' it would qualify, and what checkboxes it needs to.
-We don't control what happens to us in life, but we control how we respond to what happens in life.
-Hard times create strong men, strong men create good times, good times create weak men, and weak men create hard times. -G. Michael Hopf
Disclaimer: Post made by me are of my own creation. A delusional mind relayed in text form.
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zenux
Posts: 2972
Location: lɘɒɿƨI
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| Posted: Wed, 17th Jun 2026 00:10 Post subject: |
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| DXWarlock wrote: |
Im not retorting that it has it. It doesn't even have self-autonomy of agency yet. Even a simple multicelled biolife has that. Now that doesn't mean they are intelligent. But it is a requirement on the list of things that are required to be able to emerge intelligence. If you are missing that, you cannot skip it and go to eventually intelligent while still missing that part.
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Not even multicelled. Single celled bacteria have that.
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DXWarlock
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| Posted: Wed, 17th Jun 2026 00:38 Post subject: |
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Ah, OK, I wasnt 100% sure without looking it up if all single celled was, so I didn't want to use single cell as the example and be able to be given dozens of examples where they are purely passive, reactive only to stimuli.
-We don't control what happens to us in life, but we control how we respond to what happens in life.
-Hard times create strong men, strong men create good times, good times create weak men, and weak men create hard times. -G. Michael Hopf
Disclaimer: Post made by me are of my own creation. A delusional mind relayed in text form.
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vurt
Posts: 14372
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DXWarlock
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| Posted: Wed, 17th Jun 2026 03:06 Post subject: |
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It probably triggers something deeply hardwired. Humans have been the unchallenged apex intelligence for our entire recorded existence. Nothing has seriously competed with that. Now something might one day. That's a genuine, novel threat to a status we've never had to defend.
If it were a creature, the response would be simple: fight it. We would war with it. We couldn't let it win, God knows what it would do to us creatures less smart than it (we speculate it probably will. God help it if we win, WE will anyway).
Think of the plot of every Alien-based movie: When we are NOT smarter, we are more crafty, more 'moxy and determination', more clever. If we can't win with our only Min-Max trait, we fall back to an emotion jerking feel good narrative of 'we don't give up, we got that at least!"
And ANY AI, bot, computer, whatever villain in a movie when it's smarter than us. The plot becomes we are shifter than it is. Putting human ingenuity on a pedestal and making the computer as unclever/unwise as a box of rocks so we can win. Painting humans somehow as the only unique snowflake that can be smart AND clever.
But AI is abstract. You can't physically dominate it, can't establish hierarchy over it the way animals do. So the next best option is to diminish it rhetorically, call it fake, call it "just" statistics, fixate on what it can't do. It's the same dominance behavior, redirected toward something it doesn't work on.
So we feel we gotta stop it, before it passes us. Because what if it does? What are 'we' then? ALL we have is that we are intelligent. If we aren't #1, trigger existential crisis mode.
The anger isn't really about AI. It's about what it challanges we have been smugly confident we are the apex of since we can remember.
And it could be my pattern finding misfiring.
But at least in my circle of people I know. There seems to be a correlation between those who demean, shittalk and hate it the most and are most vocal about it with venom. Are also usually the ones that have certain...vocal opinions...on humans, not of 'their kind' too.
Not that a lot of people overall don't dislike AI, I mean, the ones that get overly animated when it comes up. But that could be, I live in the southern US, where racist AND ignorant are more common in the general population.
-We don't control what happens to us in life, but we control how we respond to what happens in life.
-Hard times create strong men, strong men create good times, good times create weak men, and weak men create hard times. -G. Michael Hopf
Disclaimer: Post made by me are of my own creation. A delusional mind relayed in text form.
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| Posted: Wed, 17th Jun 2026 03:40 Post subject: |
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AI being abstract is the base layer of the hate it gets. Like with crypto and GMOs, there is a similar reaction there. People usually react with diminishment, avoidance, or disgust.
In addition to that are all the multitude of reasons people could be against, choose:
- It's potentially very dangerous, possibly extinction level (a valid argument)
- Various ethical and societal concerns (like with any technological breakthrough)
- It automates away our jobs (that's a feature, not a bug)
- The environmental impact angle (a mere pretence)
- The religious arguments against AI (religions are fairy tales, probability of God is very low)
If it actually surpasses us, the best we can hope for is a benevolent symbiotic relationship.
We may also use the gained knowledge to enhance ourselves and become a new species. Those who do not want to live amongst them and remain regular humans can live in some kind of protected environment that is provided. The alternatives are mostly very bad.
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LeoNatan
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| Posted: Wed, 17th Jun 2026 06:45 Post subject: |
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This thread already proves it has “surpassed” some. 
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DXWarlock
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| Posted: Wed, 17th Jun 2026 06:55 Post subject: |
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Dude, dont do that. You are smart, intelligent, and handsome. Don't shit on yourself like that, its not good for the soul.
Just because it's obvious to everyone doesn't mean you need to put yourself down. Fuck what people think! AI is not smarter than you!
-We don't control what happens to us in life, but we control how we respond to what happens in life.
-Hard times create strong men, strong men create good times, good times create weak men, and weak men create hard times. -G. Michael Hopf
Disclaimer: Post made by me are of my own creation. A delusional mind relayed in text form.
Last edited by DXWarlock on Wed, 17th Jun 2026 06:57; edited 1 time in total
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LeoNatan
☢ NFOHump Despot ☢
Posts: 75008
Location: Israel
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| Posted: Wed, 17th Jun 2026 06:57 Post subject: |
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| DXWarlock wrote: | | LeoNatan wrote: | | "Intelligence", like all language we use, is rooted in our understanding of what "intelligence" is in humans. |
Yes. Same thing I said. But the key is rooted in, not based on.
And your argument was not that. It was that (in essence) it's not comparable to our specific level of intelligence.
At least your framing of it is very specific to one creature, and one metric we use on that one, and how it is not that.
I am not arguing that it's wrong, it doesn't have that, it's not. I am saying the gauge you are using to see when it meets that threshold is wrong for WHEN it will have it.
Im not retorting that it has it. It doesn't even have self-autonomy of agency yet. Even a simple multicelled biolife has that. Now that doesn't mean they are intelligent. But it is a requirement on the list of things that are required to be able to emerge intelligence. If you are missing that, you cannot skip it and go to eventually intelligent while still missing that part.
And also, metacognition is a LONG way off from its traits. That's a core foundation of signs of intelligence.
Edit: had to go find the other I could not remember: Self-modeling. (Not in the AI term of model, but behavioral). internalization of oneself, and your persistent existence as a being, that ponders and adjusts your mental 'framework' from that viewpoint. Even more animals have this.
I am responding to your checklist of what it needs to eventually be to pass, is too high. Some of the things you mention that it needs in past posts, intelligent creatures dont even have. Why would it need those to get awarded the same medal?
So maybe we are agreeing? I just say your bottom criteria (at least how I understand your phrasing in your past posts). Is a level that is so high, it WOULD have intelligence on some qualitative level, before it hits your requirements.
We both agree it's not. We disagree on 'when' it would qualify, and what checkboxes it needs to. |
So you argue using the human scale is wrong for the “AI”, but should be used to determine “AGI”, which all of you agree we have not yet reached, based on the same human scale of what “intelligence” means. For “AGI”, my criteria are fine, but for “AI”, it’s just too much. I feel like you are arguing for the sake of arguing, for the sake of contrast. There is no rational reason to split an “AI” category with an “AGI” category. The “I like it and it writes ‘code’ better than me therefore intelligence QED” of vurt style is not rational or convincing, just as a graphing calculator calculating a derivative of a complex function should not have been convincing in the 80s that the calculator has intelligence. |
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DXWarlock
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| Posted: Wed, 17th Jun 2026 06:58 Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | I feel like you are arguing for the sake of arguing, for the sake of contrast. |
No Im arguing because I disagree. You seem to confuse me with that a lot.
| LeoNatan wrote: | | There is no rational reason to split an “AI” category with an “AGI” category. |
Why not? Intelligence and General Intelligence have two distinct meanings. Both psychometrics and cognitive neuroscience agree. Adding 'artificial' to them does not change that.
You are arguing I and GI are the same. The G is a measuring scale (Sort of). If intelligence and general intelligence were identical, the word 'general' would be redundant. The qualifier wouldn't exist. The papers would just be about 'intelligence' as the word used.
The G is a latent factor that represents what's common across all cognitive tasks. Regular intelligence can be task specific. G, by definition, cannot be.
(A person could be very intelligent in a narrow area, like chess, music, coding, or social manipulation [Think Trump  ], but not necessarily have high general intelligence.)
Again, as in other debates here. I am not stating my opinion on iif they are the same. I am stating what the standard of scientific consensus is, as far as we understand now, says.
You CAN disagree, but you are not disagreeing with me. You are disagreeing with multiple fields of scientific study that collectively support the consensus that they are related but separate.
So disagree if you like, you have the right to be wrong.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/27464851/
Here is a paper that covers whether intelligent animals also have GI. As in a different definition than just intelligence, since it's given that they have that. TO be tested for GI.
It's literally what the g in g-factor stands for: General.
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC2690653/
-We don't control what happens to us in life, but we control how we respond to what happens in life.
-Hard times create strong men, strong men create good times, good times create weak men, and weak men create hard times. -G. Michael Hopf
Disclaimer: Post made by me are of my own creation. A delusional mind relayed in text form.
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| Posted: Sat, 20th Jun 2026 07:21 Post subject: |
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https://www.newsweek.com/data-center-backlash-threats-violence-anger-spreads-12091889
| Quote: | Data Center Backlash Turns to Threats and Violence as Anger Spreads
A foiled plot to attack a UFC event at the White House this month listed data centers among the grievances of the group accused of planning it, the latest sign that anger over artificial intelligence infrastructure is moving from zoning fights to threats and, in some cases, violence.
The investigation began June 10, when a 19-year-old suspect's mother called police and said her son had stockpiled weapons and joined an online group that voiced grievances about government corruption, the handling of the Jeffrey Epstein files and "data centers taking up all the water in communities," according to prosecutors.
Opposition to AI and the facilities that help it has grown into a movement over the past year. Most of it is peaceful, but a small and growing share has turned to intimidation.
In the early hours of April 10, prosecutors say, Daniel Moreno-Gama threw a Molotov cocktail at the San Francisco home of OpenAI chief executive Sam Altman, then walked to the company's headquarters and threatened to burn it down. Investigators say they found writings in which he opposed AI and warned of "our impending extinction."
Four days earlier, Indianapolis City-County Councilman Ron Gibson found that 13 rounds had been fired into his home after he voted for a data center in his district. A note left under his doormat read, "No Data Centers."
In Saline Township, Michigan, Treasurer Jennifer Zink resigned at a board meeting in May, citing death threats, including a wish that board members die of Lyme disease, tied to a 1.4-gigawatt project that is part of OpenAI and Oracle's Stargate initiative. "I can't take it anymore. The threats," she said.
The costs are appearing on utility bills. A March report from the Brookings Institution found that electricity costs had risen 42 percent since 2019.
"The fundamental question is whether middle-class families should subsidize the electricity needs of companies worth trillions of dollars," said Sanya Carley, an energy policy professor at the University of Pennsylvania.
Sarah Myers West, co-executive director of the AI Now Institute, told the Senate Banking Committee on June 11 that the investment had become "increasingly risky and capital intensive."
Independent Senator Bernie Sanders has proposed giving the public a "direct ownership stake" in the largest AI firms. Abdul El-Sayed, a Democrat running for U.S. Senate in Michigan, has called for regulating AI companies as public utilities, saying no other industry could "cause human demise to the level that AI is offering."
Florida Governor Ron DeSantis, a Republican, signed a law requiring large data centers to pay the full cost of their power, saying no resident should pay "one more red cent" because of them. Utah Senate President Stuart Adams, a Republican, pushed O'Leary's project to scale back its footprint.
Several Democratic governors who once recruited the industry have since moved to impose new limits. Josh Shapiro, JB Pritzker and Wes Moore have proposed new standards or paused incentive programs. Kathy Hochul is considering a one-year moratorium bill, and Katie Hobbs has moved to end a tax break she described as a "corporate handout."
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Dear lord.
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| Posted: Sat, 20th Jun 2026 11:19 Post subject: |
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Still nothing compared to the anti-AI extremism that's still coming. Data center bombings, assassination attempts and very large protests are likely.
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vurt
Posts: 14372
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Sat, 20th Jun 2026 11:21 Post subject: |
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yeah add it to the list which will have crazy activists who will have an excuse to commit violent acts... MSM is big culprit too, driving people insane with hatred, how many attempts at Trumps life for example, also something orchestrated by MSM.
I have seen recent MSM articles still claiming water is an issue with LLMs, solved since long. They lie to get people riled up and to commit crimes. It should be considered an act of terror to lie in an orchestrated way to drive people insane, they 100% know what they are doing. People are getting more and more retarded / tool-like and media uses it. Gen Z is the most retarded generation that has ever existed, very dangerous when its gets to that level of stupidity together with hatred.
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| Posted: Sat, 20th Jun 2026 11:29 Post subject: |
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The environmental arguments against AI are all a pretense to rile people up. The water usage claims are a wild piece of viral disinformation. It's mostly left leaning media propagating this.
But when non partisan issues like job losses and extinction risk become part of the anti-AI movement it is going to be even harder to contain and will turn more violent.
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Il_Padrino
Posts: 8036
Location: Greece by the North Sea
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| Posted: Sat, 20th Jun 2026 12:08 Post subject: |
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Any sources to back up those remarks about the environmental costs?
The numbers don't decide, the system is a lie. The river running dry, the wings of butterflies.
And you may pour us away like soup. Like we're pretty broken flowers.
We'll take back what is ours. One day at a time.
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