I'm not trolling. Many japcrap engines have terrible skin shaders, which comes out flat. It was true in MGS5, and it's true in Derp Standing. Could be an engine issue, or it could be artistic issue, considering how all engines are now all PBR, and materials are very important to a believable appearance, be it skin, leather or metal. I don't think there is any subsurface scattering on skin in Death Stranding, which contributes to the flat shading and unnaturalness of skins. But it's not just the skin. Facial hair is rendered very badly. During gameplay, the engine fades out small details and it just looks flat; but during cinematics, the facial hair is rendered in full detail, but the way it's rendered is really blocky and aliased. It looks off-putting. So the two coupled—flatly shaded skin and terrible facial hair—makes me really not like the result. Environments in DERP Stranding are OK, but still nowhere as beautiful as Red Dead Redemption 2.
Compare (this is a screenshot from my PC, maxed out at 2560x1440):
To (screenshots from the internet):
Notice the differences in shading and lighting of the skin. Where as, search for any screenshot of Sam, and you see the same flat, pale skin color rendered, regardless of the circumstances of the scene, be it a cutscene indoors, or gameplay in the field.
Characters have insane details in RDR2, be it facial hair, skin rendering and shading, clothing materials, etc.
They all have the same skin color, regardless of different character and scene.
Texture work in DReP Standing is also really weak, including PC, where you'd expect them take advantage of more RAM and more decoding power.
LeoNatan wrote:
The Derp of Us 2 really doesn't even belong in the same category graphically, at all. It doesn't look like PBR at all, to be honest, judging by these videos and screenshots.
Only pines because they're the easiest trees to make 2D LODs of... This is a very lazy developer, not really intereted in pushing their graphics forward. They're the exact opposite of R* (amazing artists, i'd say the best in the industry).
Don't game developers use third-party tree libraries these days (like SpeedTree)? It seems crazy to try and create all these flora objects, rather than use a generator. SpeedTree used to be really nice back in the day several years ago, why not use that?
Don't game developers use third-party tree libraries these days (like SpeedTree)? It seems crazy to try and create all these flora objects, rather than use a generator. SpeedTree used to be really nice back in the day several years ago, why not use that?
Speedtree is awesome, but it's also not push a button to generate a tree and everything can be imported and will work for any game.
There could be a number of reasons why a dev doesn't want (or can't) use it, most likely it has to do with performance or incorporating the speedtree system into the game engine, or some fee they'll have to pay them for each sold game.
I'm not trolling. Many japcrap engines have terrible skin shaders, which comes out flat. ...snip...
I appreciate you took the time to flesh out your point.
I think I understand what you are getting at, but looking at the screens, for me it comes down to artistic choices in lighting rather than technological limitations.
Take a look at Digital Foundry's analysis on DS:
Digital Foundry wrote:
Skin shading is similarly impressive - with realistic sub-surface scattering present as light plays off the surface. Multiple texture layers are used to simulate skin folds as characters animate, while small hairs can be observed across the surface, glistening in the light. Even aspects such as allergic reactions and goose bumps are represented beautifully and realistically. Again, many games do a great job with skin rendering, but I feel Death Stranding is a step above, while its ability to realistically render a variety of hair types without artefacts is also highly impressive..
or on TLOU2:
Digital Foundry wrote:
As expected, the level of detail here is almost absurd, right down to the uncanny sub-surface scattering of light through skin, the level of detail right down to the fingertips and crucially, the quality of eye rendering.
And that in your opinion is really really badly done? Have you seen the vast majority of games out there for any platform?
I'm not trolling. Many japcrap engines have terrible skin shaders, which comes out flat. ...snip...
I appreciate you took the time to flesh out your point.
I think I understand what you are getting at, but looking at the screens, for me it comes down to artistic choices in lighting rather than technological limitations.
Take a look at Digital Foundry's analysis on DS:
Digital Foundry wrote:
Skin shading is similarly impressive - with realistic sub-surface scattering present as light plays off the surface. Multiple texture layers are used to simulate skin folds as characters animate, while small hairs can be observed across the surface, glistening in the light. Even aspects such as allergic reactions and goose bumps are represented beautifully and realistically. Again, many games do a great job with skin rendering, but I feel Death Stranding is a step above, while its ability to realistically render a variety of hair types without artefacts is also highly impressive..
or on TLOU2:
Digital Foundry wrote:
As expected, the level of detail here is almost absurd, right down to the uncanny sub-surface scattering of light through skin, the level of detail right down to the fingertips and crucially, the quality of eye rendering.
And that in your opinion is really really badly done? Have you seen the vast majority of games out there for any platform?
I don’t put too much value in DF praise; they get paid to be excited about everything. Look above, they are making retarded excuses why Halo looks so bad.
I can only evaluate what I see with my own eyes.
Graphic engines are only that, rending a game, so a lot more is needed to make a good looking game than an engine. Art style, materials, shaders are all very important. I can’t say this way or the other regarding Death Stranding; could be an artistic choice (perhaps some Japanese art preference), or it could be lackluster assets. Either way, for me what matters is the final result, and I don’t find DS visually pleasing, especially the characters. For me the uncanny valley is strong in that game. And at least on PC, there are many artifacts (in the form of aliasing) with facial and normal hair. Very blocky. Many games have this issue, but not RDR2.
TLOU2 clearly looks like an inferior engine as well as art assets. You can see it from the simplistic shaders to the low poly geometry to low textures. That’s not to say the game itself is bad, just not the most impressive looking. I don’t see any of what is said by DF in videos or screenshots I’ve looked at. I don’t have a PS, so I don’t have a first-hand experience with that game.
BTW, they all look much better than “next gen” Halo.
I just don't see it looking "one of the best", certainly not "best". I'm sure the game is great, but my comments in this thread have been technological only. I don't think Naughty Dog's engine is very good from what I've seen in their games.
For example, I hate the recent Assassins Creed games, but I think Ubisoft's "AnvilNextNext 2.0++++++" engine is one of the better ones this generation. Couple this with their world-class material artists (in my opinion and taste), Ubisoft has some of the strongest output graphically this generation. They had a hard time getting it out of the door at first with Unity, but right now, their engine is good.
I'm here for the memez. How the fuck did this game ever get past first presentation to the team
Because boomers in suits, who doesn't have any great interest in games at all, they're there for the money.
Don't underestimate how much power these people have sometimes. "the game should have good.. graphax, not like that pac-man game, and it should have things that young people like!"
I'm here for the memez. How the fuck did this game ever get past first presentation to the team
Because boomers in suits, who doesn't have any great interest in games at all, they're there for the money.
Don't underestimate how much power these people have sometimes. "the game should have good.. graphax, not like that pac-man game, and it should have things that young people like!"
Indeed! It always makes me smile when I see these corporate buffoons in the posed photos, with their fake casual clothes, grinning away holding a controller or pointing at a screenshot. You know 100% they haven't got the slightest fucking clue or genuine interest in what they're holding or looking at
If you're gonna be consistent perhaps don't use words like "Millennials" if "boomer" offends you, they're similarly new words describing a certain generation you fucking derp.
And no, you're obviously wrong, they are not the ones in the absolute tops of these companies, the huge investors and owners are older people, usually not in the foreground very much. They're clueless about stuff like graphics, younger people are not.
well sony are just being pricks since they own the market. I love sony's games, but i hope it bites them in the ass. All this attitude only ultimately ends up affecting us consumers, and for that i wouldnt hate seeing them suffer for a bit
Ps5 controllers have new features.
Made for new games.
Ps4 dont have said features.
So clearly incompatible.
Xbox controllers have same features throughout.
So controllers will obviously work.
It's not being pricks. It's being innovative.
Upgrading and adding new things.
Xbox is pretty much saying new xbox is same as old xbox just higher specs. Who in their right mind would want to upgrade just for newer gfx in a new console?
Same with nintendo. New console new playstyle new features. You upgrade and make sure the new gen is worth the upgrade. Not just gfx.
Ps5 has the same amount of buttons as ps4.
Same identical features only a few extras added.
The reason it wont work is cause they want to push product so theyll call rumble something uhd rumble like nintendos hd rumble. But better. And therefore ps4 controller is incompatible with games that require uhd rumble.
That's all it is. Therell be a software update down the road to allow ps4 controllers to work on non ps4 games on ps5 - and people will praise sony for making the impossible happen.
Doesnt exclude/dismiss the fancy new features theyll put in the controller. But for marketing and pr and sales... new features of the advanced new ps5 controller will take full advantage of new advanced 4k ports of ps4 games on ps5 that ps4 controller simply cannot.
Simple. Lol.
Xbox jumping right into the gate saying sup itll work. Is just silly pr. Wouldve just said we dont mess with perfection, we enhance it. But, I guess it's their we can share games with friends moment.
cyclonefr wrote:
WaldoJ wrote:
If they have different rumble.
Different input method.
Special features for the controller
Then yes.
Ok, do you think Assassins Creed Valhalla will paly the differently on PS5 than PS4, when it's clearly cross play ? Same with Cyberpunk ?
... Now you are trolling me hard.
Of course it won't. But marketing will tell you otherwise. And you will eat it up and accept it. Because thinking outside of console marketing makes you a candy crush casual.
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