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 Posted: Sun, 27th Dec 2015 19:26 Post subject: |
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same as they did about five years ago with the ps3, that private key stuff was the start for the other hacks wasnt it?
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NFOAC
Posts: 6015
Location: India
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| Posted: Mon, 28th Dec 2015 03:40 Post subject: |
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I guess whatever they showed for ps3 last time never got materialised
Any link of what happened now?
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| Posted: Mon, 28th Dec 2015 11:15 Post subject: |
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| NFOAC wrote: |
Any link of what happened now? |
From what I read on the CCC wiki (down at the moment, but reacahable through google cache) the talk should be in the "lghtning talks" block, a series of short talks happening on Day 4 (the 30th):
https://events.ccc.de/congress/2015/Fahrplan/events/7560.html
At this point I'm not very hopeful tho, given the short length I'm guessing they'll just show it off without explaining anything of how it's done.
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NFOAC
Posts: 6015
Location: India
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| Posted: Mon, 28th Dec 2015 17:17 Post subject: |
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The website is loading fine
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Przepraszam
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Posts: 14506
Location: Poland. New York.
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| Posted: Mon, 28th Dec 2015 19:03 Post subject: |
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Whole lot of nothing. Like always.
I just hope this 1.76 won't be collecting dust for next two years.
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| Posted: Tue, 29th Dec 2015 03:25 Post subject: |
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| Przepraszam wrote: | Whole lot of nothing. Like always.
I just hope this 1.76 won't be collecting dust for next two years. |
Wouldn't get my hopes up if they didn't release anything, they still need to crack the securtiy or whatever is needed to play pirated games.
Which is prolly our only intrest we want out of it, right? I don't care for homebrew anyway, who does lol?
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| Posted: Tue, 29th Dec 2015 10:53 Post subject: |
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if the system itself is broken open the security stuff for games should be the least problem. without homebrew -> no piracy for you
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| Posted: Wed, 30th Dec 2015 14:11 Post subject: |
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Aaaaand... it's over.
Basically, they demoed a custom Linux distro for ps4, and they are going to release the kernel source on GiHub. But how to make it run, i.e.: the exploit that they used as an entry point, they're not gonna tell.
| Quote: | | "Bring Your Own Hack" (Ps4 security is crappy enough that you don't need us for that) |
is literally what they said.
So, basically, nothing worth noting.
I never played the ps4, so don't know if you can tell from the appearence of the menus whether it was running 1.76 or newer, maybe someone else has some clues? That would be interesting.
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| Posted: Wed, 30th Dec 2015 14:22 Post subject: |
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PS: you can watch the talk here:
http://streaming.media.ccc.de/32c3/relive/7560/
(fail0verflow segment starts 1h31m)
Last edited by The_Leaf on Wed, 30th Dec 2015 17:09; edited 1 time in total
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NFOAC
Posts: 6015
Location: India
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| Posted: Wed, 30th Dec 2015 16:33 Post subject: |
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They even said that ps3 was wide open and after that no clues of them.
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Przepraszam
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Posts: 14506
Location: Poland. New York.
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| Posted: Wed, 30th Dec 2015 19:09 Post subject: |
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| Posted: Wed, 30th Dec 2015 19:37 Post subject: |
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Video of the presentation:
https://www.youtube.com/embed/2A7V3GLWF6U
From what I read, it's definetely a ps4 on an old (< 2.50) firmware, at least from what some owners have said, based on the layout and icons of the menus.
So yeah, nothing new under the sun basically.
On the plus side, having a fully working linux kernel at hand will be a good starting point if/when an exploit to run unsigned code is actually released.
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| Posted: Thu, 31st Dec 2015 16:54 Post subject: |
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From fail0verflow site (hilights are mine):
| Quote: | Two years ago, I said that the PS4 was not a particularly interesting device, being a glorified PC. What happened?
Essentially, two things: First, we’re hackers, and hacking consoles is fun after all. Second, it turned out that the PS4 isn’t really a PC (which makes it a more interesting target), while being enough of a PC to have some serious advantages. It’s hard enough to be interesting, and easy enough to be practical.
Let’s recap the (very simplified) history of game console hacks that we have been involved with:
On the Wii, we basically drove the entire homebrew community, from exploits to libraries to infrastructure. The community ended up being very large and productive, with lots of interesting releases. However, the people interested in game piracy were always riding on the coattails of homebrew since relatively early on, and greatly benefited from it.
On the PS3, we tried releasing the exploits and letting others sort out the community. The result was that, for all practical purposes, the only users were those interested in piracy. AsbestOS allowed Linux to work again, but since there was no GPU driver, and the CPU was underpowered and annoying to work with, there wasn’t that much interest beyond those who were already running OtherOS.
On the Wii U, we tried to get the community to display interest and work on Linux support before releasing the exploits. Although there were certainly several interested people, nobody with the right experience stepped up to actually make it a reality. Eventually others released exploits, and quickly a piracy tool has become one of the primary use cases for them.
For the PS4, therefore, we’re yet again trying something new. It seems that the PS4 security architecture is rather straightforward and simple; the OS is based on FreeBSD, and the browser uses WebKit, both of which are open source. It is relatively easy to find exploits in both of them (all things considered), and that is all you need to chain into a Linux loader. However, as we found out, even though the hardware is certainly similar to a PC, it is not a PC, and Linux needs quite a bit of extra work to get running. Thus, we can add more value to the homebrew ecosystem by helping port Linux than by releasing exploits.
Of course, this also absolves us from responsibility for potentially enabling piracy (and online play hacking and other undesirable outcomes), but we think it might even have a net positive effect: if we can get people interested in running Linux on the PS4 over using the native OS, we can redirect efforts away from reverse engineering the original software infrastructure (which is what the piracy guys need, and they inevitably leech off of those efforts) to Linux (which is completely useless for piracy).
Linux on the PS4 actually makes a lot of sense, more than it ever did on any previous game console. It’s close enough to a PC that getting 3D acceleration working, while rather painful (as we’ve learned), seems entirely possible without undue amounts of effort (in a timeframe of months, not years), to the level needed for real indie games and even AAA titles, not just homebrew. And many thousands of indie and AAA games already run on Linux. Yes, SteamOS on the PS4 should “just work” once the driver issues are sorted out. We demoed a silly GBA emulator because all we had was a 2D framebuffer, but the real fun is getting 3D games to run just like they do on a PC (we’ve tried some commercial indie games already and they do work fine, just painfully slow as they are using software rendering right now, of course).
Although the exploits used in our demo were our own work (we in fact had Linux booting, albeit in a very broken state, well before any PS4 exploits were publicly announced - porting Linux takes time), the fact that other teams have also been able to get kernel code execution proves the point that you really don’t need to depend on us for that aspect. We also have no doubt that vulnerabilities in the latest firmware can be found without too much trouble. Incidentally, everything is pure software. Hardware stuff was only used for research. There is not much reason to resort to hardware-based exploits on an architecture like the PS4, with a very wide attack surface and mediocre isolation.
So, to the community: if you’re interested, we really think this is the way to go for the PS4. Write an exploit, point it to our loader, and you’ll get Linux (we’ll help you get it hooked up/debugged if needed). And if you want piracy, as usual, go away.
As for release timeframes: right now, the code is in a pretty ugly state, and some components are not releasable (e.g. they contain a bit of code that has been directly reverse engineered from Sony modifications to FreeBSD and needs to be rewritten/cleanroomed). Our goal is to eventually get the patches upstreamed in the Linux kernel, but in the meantime we will open up a work-in-progress repo as soon as is practical. If you’re interested, want to contribute, and have access to a PS4 kernel level exploit, feel free to get in contact with us so we know who wants to help out.
For those curious: the current status of 3D support is that we can get the kernel driver to enable acceleration (with some issues), but command buffer execution is currently broken because GPUVM is not working properly (page flipping works, but nothing is rendered, as the command buffer itself triggers a GPU page fault). We’re actively working on debugging this. If you happen to work on the Radeon DRI driver or are familiar with it, we could use a hand here  .
TL;DR: We’re working on Linux kernel patches, and are looking to get them upstreamed. We’re not releasing exploits - we’re certain other people will. Don’t ask us. And if you want free games, go away. |
TL,DR:
-They used "their own exploit", not the CTurt one, but they're not releasing it
-No hardware modding necessary, it's purely a softmod
-They seem extremely confident that people will release exploits, and that exploiting the newer versions of the firmware is possible
-In the following weeks/months they'll release patches to make the linux kernel boot on the Ps4, they're fixing 3D acceleration at the moment.
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Horrordee
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Posts: 8868
Location: England
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| Posted: Thu, 31st Dec 2015 17:28 Post subject: |
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So much noise yet nothing but BS. Until something is public ally released I couldn't give a crap
Space for rent. Contact me for rates!
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segobi
Posts: 1565
Location: FBI Cybercrime div.
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| Posted: Thu, 31st Dec 2015 17:28 Post subject: |
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wow nice - a lot of wasted talent and time. why run linux on ps4 anyway ? use your pc for that.
they basically admit that they are not able to reverse the original firmware - pointing exploits at a patched linux is not that hard anyway.
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Przepraszam
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Posts: 14506
Location: Poland. New York.
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| Posted: Thu, 31st Dec 2015 17:29 Post subject: |
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The good old hackers morale.
Tehehhehe
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| Posted: Thu, 31st Dec 2015 17:30 Post subject: |
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Kodi on the ps4 via linux would be awesome ..after watching the video Ito may just happen
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segobi
Posts: 1565
Location: FBI Cybercrime div.
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| Posted: Thu, 31st Dec 2015 17:31 Post subject: |
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| hitmanuk wrote: | | Kodi on the ps4 via linux would be awesome ..after watching the video Ito may just happen |
there is better and cheaper hardware for that already out there - and after all you will not be able to play the latest games anymore if you are running on that < 2.0 stuff.
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segobi
Posts: 1565
Location: FBI Cybercrime div.
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| Posted: Thu, 31st Dec 2015 17:44 Post subject: |
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but maybe running linux with full ring 0 access gives out some easier way to find and patch certain things.... lets see.
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| Posted: Thu, 31st Dec 2015 17:53 Post subject: |
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| segobi wrote: | wow nice - a lot of wasted talent and time. why run linux on ps4 anyway ? use your pc for that.
they basically admit that they are not able to reverse the original firmware - pointing exploits at a patched linux is not that hard anyway. |
I think there's still value in it, because if there is a working linux kernel for the ps4 there will be more people interested in running it, so more people working on finding exploits to unlock the ps4.
Everything hinges around that tho: someone has to release a proper exploit (hopefully not limited to kernel 1.76). They say they are "sure" that it is possible. We'll have to see about that...
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| Posted: Thu, 31st Dec 2015 18:32 Post subject: |
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Yes this is currently useless.
It's not helping at all to hack the ps4 OS and this is what is most important, not to transform a ps4 into a steambox...
But that was quite expected after the PS3 hack and later on the Wii U hack that didn't lead to anything on their side.
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headshot
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Location: UK
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| Posted: Thu, 31st Dec 2015 20:08 Post subject: |
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Horrordee
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Posts: 8868
Location: England
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| Posted: Thu, 31st Dec 2015 22:51 Post subject: |
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| headshot wrote: | | http://www.kotaku.co.uk/2015/12/31/hackers-get-pokemon-running-on-a-ps4 |
Again unless they're going to release something who gives a shit about these attention whores?
Space for rent. Contact me for rates!
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segobi
Posts: 1565
Location: FBI Cybercrime div.
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| Posted: Fri, 1st Jan 2016 10:52 Post subject: |
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im sure this will at least give us some publically available exploit to get in....
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| Posted: Fri, 1st Jan 2016 14:02 Post subject: |
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The WebKit exploit was already released for 1.76.
Just not the kernel one.
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Przepraszam
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Posts: 14506
Location: Poland. New York.
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| Posted: Sun, 3rd Jan 2016 21:25 Post subject: |
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Meh. Looks like I will going to return the 1.76.
Maybe next year we will get something.
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| Posted: Mon, 4th Jan 2016 13:35 Post subject: |
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why not keeping it and using it?
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| Posted: Tue, 5th Jan 2016 14:53 Post subject: |
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https://github.com/fail0verflow/ps4-linux
The ps4 Linux fork has been released by fail0verflow.
Again, useless without an exploit to jump start it, but very interesting nonetheless. Also of note: they posted a screenshot showing 3d acceleration working, will probably be merged soon.
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| Posted: Tue, 5th Jan 2016 18:26 Post subject: |
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the ps4 os aka orbisos is just a newer version of their ps3 freebsd right?
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