I have absolutely no idea how they're pulling this off, but apparently there will be real time path-tracing demos on DK2 at Siggraph using Brigade and Octane. Is this really happening?! Whatever tricks they have up their sleeves, I need to know more. This is going to completely change everything.
VR is NOT a 3d screen
it is NOT an addon, an extension, an improvement for traditional games
it's the first piece of a whole new platform and type of play
trying to play traditional games with VR gear is just baaaaaaaaad and will leave people with a really terrible gimmicky impression or just nausea
retrofitting old games is an exercise in futility
i just held a 25 minute speech on just this issue at assembly a few hours ago
i wrote the speech because i was tired of going over this same conversation time after time
it'll be on youtube later
This. Palmer actually did a talk on porting games to VR and he seriously started it off with "Don't port your game to VR". You can reuse assets, but most of the time there are serious scale issues (You and doorways feeling 4 feet tall, lightbulbs being the size of grapefruits, etc.) and comfort issues as well (speed, acceleration, cutscenes, etc.). The only ones that have worked have either been flukes or have had an extensive amount of work to make them comfortable, like Minecrift.
those are the least of the issues
the computer interaction abstraction of the modern games is the entire art form
kb/mouse + rift is not and never will be VR
it's just putting a bandaid on abstraction
btw, this michael abrash's talk should be required viewing for everyone interested in vr
VR is NOT a 3d screen
it is NOT an addon, an extension, an improvement for traditional games
it's the first piece of a whole new platform and type of play
trying to play traditional games with VR gear is just baaaaaaaaad and will leave people with a really terrible gimmicky impression or just nausea
retrofitting old games is an exercise in futility
i just held a 25 minute speech on just this issue at assembly a few hours ago
i wrote the speech because i was tired of going over this same conversation time after time
it'll be on youtube later
This. Palmer actually did a talk on porting games to VR and he seriously started it off with "Don't port your game to VR". You can reuse assets, but most of the time there are serious scale issues (You and doorways feeling 4 feet tall, lightbulbs being the size of grapefruits, etc.) and comfort issues as well (speed, acceleration, cutscenes, etc.). The only ones that have worked have either been flukes or have had an extensive amount of work to make them comfortable, like Minecrift.
those are the least of the issues
the computer interaction abstraction of the modern games is the entire art form
kb/mouse + rift is not and never will be VR
it's just putting a bandaid on abstraction
btw, this michael abrash's talk should be required viewing for everyone interested in vr
Dude, that talk is by far the best explanation for why people will remain skeptical of VR until they actually try it for the first time. His comparison of describing VR with words to describing color to the blind is spot on.
And you're right about input being an issue, but honestly the same can be said even for games developed specifically for VR. Devs are still trying to figure out first person turning without making the player vomit. Personally, I just close my eyes every single time I make a turn. The Gallery's recent implementation looks pretty interesting, but I haven't tried it myself. I cannot wait to see whatever input solution Oculus is working on. If I had to take a guess, with all the amazing talent they've hired, I imagine it's going to be pretty damn epic.
This. Palmer actually did a talk on porting games to VR and he seriously started it off with "Don't port your game to VR". You can reuse assets, but most of the time there are serious scale issues (You and doorways feeling 4 feet tall, lightbulbs being the size of grapefruits, etc.) and comfort issues as well (speed, acceleration, cutscenes, etc.). The only ones that have worked have either been flukes or have had an extensive amount of work to make them comfortable, like Minecrift.
So you're saying HL2 is shit in VR? Never tried it myself.
*edit* I should say all of what I wrote here is based on my experience with HL2 back before they let the Oculus Configuration tool define the IPD. So a lot may have changed with the experience (or it may not), it may mean that the HL2VR Mod doesn't work anymore, I don't know.
HL2VR works VERY well in the Rift and is arguably my favorite VR application to date. But it's a very rare exception, and few games could ever be ported to VR like HL2. Like Yondaime said, HL2 was prophetically "built" to create the illusion that you are in Freeman's shoes. Gordon doesn't speak, most cutscenes are in-game and viewed from Gordon's POV, and pre-VR, the Source engine supported the Razer Hydra for aiming.
I can confirm HL2VR works fine using the Oculus Configuration tool to define the IPD. Granted, it only works in DK1 and some of the more recent changes by Valve have broken the episodes. Afaik there is no way to play HL2 in DK2, but when it's ported over it should be an incredible experience.
hl2vr port by wormslayer is clearly the best port of an existing game
it implements positional tracking and proper gun controls through razer hydras, something most "real" oculus games don't have
it's a really good VR experience, but it's basically a remake of the entire player character interaction model
it wouldn't be possible with any other engine at this level, as source engine has partly support for a lot of things in it already
but while the player character and control port is really successful, the level design is still awkward in vr
it's been designed for the desktop, and things that make desktop play exciting
be careful and report
edit: actually, it seems that cloth is terrible and causing problems. it is not same cloth as dk1
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1- Sell thousand of OR,
2- Be sure to put crappy lens which need to be replaced every 2 weeks,
3- Prepare huge tons of cheap lens stock and an easy access online store,
4- Profit !
BTW, does the "toothpaste trick" remove these scratches ?
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I will be using the cloth from my fancy Sunglasses.
"Enlightenment is man's emergence from his self-imposed nonage. Nonage is the inability to use one's own understanding without another's guidance. This nonage is self-imposed if its cause lies not in lack of understanding but in indecision and lack of courage to use one's own mind without another's guidance. Dare to know! (Sapere aude.) "Have the courage to use your own understanding," is therefore the motto of the enlightenment."
lol, they're idiots or just trolling for attention.. You would need to scratch it really really bad for it to be visible. I read about one guy that scratched his lens because his glasses got in contact with it, it was a deep scratch but still not actually visible when using it. Those superficial scratches from the cloth would obviously not be visible in any way when actually using it.
As a side note i've used the cloth + my t-shirt ( ) there isnt a single scratch.
Check the screens on your phones when its turned off, i'm sure some of you have ~1000 tiny scratches just like mine.. Obviously it's still impossible to see any of them when its turned on.
Those superficial scratches from the cloth would obviously not be visible in any way when actually using it.
This. I can't make any first hand conclusions about the DK2, but I simply do wear glasses every day and when you look at them they seem pretty scratched. Tiny micro scratches everywhere, that might look really bad to somebody not wearing glasses. However, when I put the glasses on there is nothing to notice, because it is so close to the eyes you just can't notice these small things.
Like you said, there would need to be a significant scratch on there to notice it during use.
Most people complaining are either unexperienced with this kind of stuff or simple attention whores.
โThe only way to deal with an unfree world is to become so absolutely free that your very existence is an act of rebellion.โ
- Albert Camus
I think you're both being incredibly unfair by claiming that anyone with scratched lens are "idiots", "trolls" or "attention whores" and then brushing complaints aside with "you won't see it anyway" - I don't know about you, but I sure as hell never scratched any screen I ever had in such a short time. If this is a genuine issue then it needs to be addressed, not brushed aside or having people who had this happen be insulted for their troubles. There's a lot of complaints about this, more than can simply be attributed to "user error" - especially considering it supposedly didn't happen with DK1 and that these are people that have paid $350 for something and waited for it a long time, people that would usually take care of something expensive, rare and sought after.
Unless they're all trolling idiotic attention whores.
Lets just say I don't understand how they do it. I read the thread on the official forums and i see a lot of people with the same experience as i have, that they don't scratch.
This is very common on many forums, one or two really loud users are complaining about something and suddenly it's a common fact
This is very common on many forums, one or two really loud users are stating they're not having any problems and suddenly it's a cast-iron fact that nobody does
See how that works? I'm *not* saying this is a major issue, I'm *not* saying people aren't trying to cause trouble (for whatever reason), I'm just saying that there are some accounts of people reporting issues that weren't present on DK1 and that it should be looked at, not discounted unless you have absolute proof they're bullshitting or just plain stupid. It's not exactly a cheap device and if there are issues for *some* people for whatever reason then it needs to be examined
Haha no, it must be something negative. "The lenses are really great, they dont scratch!", such a post would perhaps get 1 reply in a day. Say something negative and you will have 20+ replies in an hour with a ton of angry people, no matter if they have the issue or not.
When cleaning the lens it's obviously a good idea to 1) not rub like a fucking mad person, gentle does it 2) make sure the cloth is clean from things that might have gotten entangled in it (sand or whatever). Combining 1+2 = scratches.
Haha no, it must be something negative. "The lenses are really great, they dont scratch!", such a post would perhaps get 1 reply in a day. Say something negative and you will have 20+ replies in an hour with a ton of angry people, no matter if they have the issue or not.
When cleaning the lens it's obviously a good idea to 1) not rub like a fucking mad person, gentle does it 2) make sure the cloth is clean from things that might have gotten entangled in it (sand or whatever). Combining 1+2 = scratches.
I am guessing Timechange has been at his lenses today with an oven scourer and window cleaner?
Haha no, it must be something negative. "The lenses are really great, they dont scratch!", such a post would perhaps get 1 reply in a day. Say something negative and you will have 20+ replies in an hour with a ton of angry people, no matter if they have the issue or not.
When cleaning the lens it's obviously a good idea to 1) not rub like a fucking mad person, gentle does it 2) make sure the cloth is clean from things that might have gotten entangled in it (sand or whatever). Combining 1+2 = scratches.
I am guessing Timechange has been at his lenses today with an oven scourer and window cleaner?
That's definitely not TC enough, he'd at least use some chlorine/ammonia - or preferably both because that pops so nicely!
Sin317-"im 31 years old and still surprised at how much shit comes out of my ass actually ..."
SteamDRM-"Call of Duty is the symbol of the true perfection in every aspect. Call of Duty games are like Mozart's/Beethoven's symphonies"
deadpoetic-"are you new to the cyberspace?"
lol. i had the same thought after playing solarsystemexplorer.. but i hope i can wait since i've already backed Elite..
Oh, and i bought Euro Truck Simulator 2 yesterday and i hate trucks / cars, i haven't got even the slightest interest. It's still kind of stimulating to play it with the Rift.
Hmm the things you do to get a slice of that 3D
Last edited by vurt on Sun, 3rd Aug 2014 22:51; edited 1 time in total
You backed it only for the full game? Yeah, wait it out.
Well, I tested it, and it's buggy due to old SDK use, but what I did manage to see was amazing. Resolution of DK2 is still very low, though, so it's hard to read text still. How some people played with the old one I would never know...
But holy shit, this is amazing! The cockpit, looking around at the world, the sound... Now I can't stop thinking about why I can't hop into my spaceship and just be alone with the Universe for a month or so...
Not sure what kind of hardware you're running, but my GTX 770 OC is struggling pretty hard with this game. Be prepared to lower your settings. I started on High and the judder was so bad I stopped playing after a few seconds. Loaded up FRAPS and took some screens, realizing I was getting 50-65 fps. Set my preset to Low and the judder almost disappeared completely. I still get occasional judder....and even occasional judder is godawful. I'm definitely getting an 880 when they hit. Pretty epic game though. I still have absolutely no clue what I'm doing, but it's pretty damn beautiful.
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) there isnt a single scratch.
Now I can't stop thinking about why I can't hop into my spaceship and just be alone with the Universe for a month or so... 
