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prudislav
VIP Member
Posts: 29148
Location: The land of beer and porn
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 Posted: Fri, 26th Jul 2013 23:33 Post subject: |
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| Posted: Fri, 26th Jul 2013 23:37 Post subject: |
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So, is it posible to download mods for the non-legit version? If so, where from?
| Frant wrote: | | Shitass games are ruining piracy. |
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| Posted: Fri, 26th Jul 2013 23:38 Post subject: |
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Usually, yes, but right now it seems most are being published to Workshop. Check out the official forum on Shadowrun.com and look at the "User Generated Content" subsection, see if anything's there yet. I know MacDougal said he's going to compile his work for both Workshop and DRM-free, though I don't know if he has yet.
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| Posted: Fri, 26th Jul 2013 23:42 Post subject: |
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Thanks, mate, will do.
| Frant wrote: | | Shitass games are ruining piracy. |
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| Posted: Fri, 26th Jul 2013 23:43 Post subject: |
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There's another way too though I'm not ENTIRELY sure how it would work, but I'm fairly sure you could simply copy the CPZ file from the SRR Steam location and upload it for others to use in their DRM-free SRR AppData\Local location.
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| Posted: Sat, 27th Jul 2013 00:20 Post subject: |
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| akvma wrote: | | Prefetian wrote: | | sabin1981 wrote: | | Just report him mate. |
Done |
You guys could just ignore him instead of being such sensible pussies. I mean what the fuck. |
You just can't make a man from a cunt.
A pussy will be allways a pussy.
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[sYn]
[Moderator] Elitist
Posts: 8374
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| Posted: Sat, 27th Jul 2013 00:40 Post subject: |
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| Prefetian wrote: | WHO THE FUCK ARE YOU TALKING TO?!?!
I've seen you spam this thread with pointless shit over 3-4 pages now, will you stop spamming you stupid cunt!
Fucking Ginormous Sphincter Phil 11 (or DPSgaming as he's called). |
Was there any need for that? Use the report button and if you don't feel like enough action has been taken PM a mod directly to find out why. You came close to a ban yourself for the post above but given the person you aimed it at has been banned for trolling I'll assume he pushed too far.
Still, keep it civil.
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| Posted: Sat, 27th Jul 2013 01:06 Post subject: |
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I went through and entered all those backer codes posted a few pages back and did not really notice anything new for the female elf or female human portraits so I am not sure if I entered them correctly or maybe it just uses whatever the last code entered is. I did get the Backer ability in the Seamstress Union though so I at least know that part is working.
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| Posted: Sat, 27th Jul 2013 01:09 Post subject: |
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Well there's some backer portraits in the game installation dir, look in:
X:\<game-folder>\Steam\SteamApps\common\Shadowrun Returns\Shadowrun_Data\StreamingAssets\ContentPacks\seattle\art\portraits
You'll see them there. I don't know if those are characters from the main story though. Some look a bit fishy, plus (like you said) the codes don't activate them as options when customizing your character.
Last edited by 4treyu on Sat, 27th Jul 2013 01:29; edited 1 time in total
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| Posted: Sat, 27th Jul 2013 01:21 Post subject: |
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Ok just checked and that folder has 319 items in it, not sure what the count is if you do not enter any codes. Maybe eventually there will be model replacements as I could see myself being very amused while playing as backer_dwarfmale_peteparsons.png just going by that portrait. Have him be melee so he just punches people in the nuts all the time.
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| Posted: Sat, 27th Jul 2013 01:44 Post subject: |
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Just finished.
First off, I still have absolutely no idea what exactly it is the Leylines buff (magic damage, hit chance, refresh? who the fuck knows, it isn't mentioned anywhere).
Secondly, whoever claimed 10 hours is full of it. This would be an accurate figure if you didn't read any of the text. Took me around 16 on Hard difficulty.
Another major problem I had is that the Charisma/Etiquette system was far too underutilized and generally a waste of points. I'm fairly certain I never ran across a single "Socialite" option, with the others making an appearance less than half a dozen times at best.
It's also very apparent that the last 1/3rd of the game or so was massively rushed. The writing is full of typos past a certain point, and the campaign makes the mistake of relying on a stupid gimmick at the end merely to prolong the fights.
All that having been said - the writing, ambiance, and general feel of the game was solid, and it's definitely going to be a classic given time.
However, I can't help but feel that these developers are cutting corners and stuffing their pockets full of Kickstarter money rather than spending it wisely. There simply isn't 1.8m USD worth of content here any way you slice it. The music was great, but there's not much of it. Same goes for the sound/spell effects. Not sure where all that money is going, but it wouldn't surprise me if someone's filling their pockets.
I can never be free, because the shackles I wear can't be touched or be seen.
i9-9900k, MSI MPG-Z390 Gaming Pro Carbon, 32GB DDR4 @ 3000, eVGA GTX 1080 DT, Samsung 970 EVO Plus nVME 1TB
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| Posted: Sat, 27th Jul 2013 02:15 Post subject: |
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Like the game so far. It definitely has some problems, but the ambience, music, basic systems and even the idea behind main quest are all top notch. At the very least it's more intriguing than saving the world from aliens/darkness/ancient evil for a 1000(000)th time. The writing is also quite decent, at times okeyish, at other times really good.
With better animations and spell effects, some exploration and more optional content, this could have been something. It's still a good experience, though, so no point in whining about it.
A question for those who finished the game already.  Spoiler: | How far in am I if I just went to Sam's funeral? |
Because it's starting to feel a bit endgame'y and that would really be quite a shame.
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| Posted: Sat, 27th Jul 2013 02:23 Post subject: |
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You still have a ways to go.
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| Posted: Sat, 27th Jul 2013 02:27 Post subject: |
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| 4treyu wrote: | Well there's some backer portraits in the game installation dir, look in:
X:\<game-folder>\Steam\SteamApps\common\Shadowrun Returns\Shadowrun_Data\StreamingAssets\ContentPacks\seattle\art\portraits
You'll see them there. I don't know if those are characters from the main story though. Some look a bit fishy, plus (like you said) the codes don't activate them as options when customizing your character. |
| 0wen wrote: | | Ok just checked and that folder has 319 items in it, not sure what the count is if you do not enter any codes. Maybe eventually there will be model replacements as I could see myself being very amused while playing as backer_dwarfmale_peteparsons.png just going by that portrait. Have him be melee so he just punches people in the nuts all the time. |
I have seen many of those backer portraits used for both NPCs in-campaign and hireable NPCs.
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fisk
Posts: 9145
Location: Von Oben
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| Posted: Sat, 27th Jul 2013 03:08 Post subject: |
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| Immunity wrote: |
However, I can't help but feel that these developers are cutting corners and stuffing their pockets full of Kickstarter money rather than spending it wisely. There simply isn't 1.8m USD worth of content here any way you slice it. The music was great, but there's not much of it. Same goes for the sound/spell effects. Not sure where all that money is going, but it wouldn't surprise me if someone's filling their pockets. |
Everyone is of course entitled to their opinion. Though presenting an opinion and backing it on some sort of reasoning or fact is usually prudent.
1.8 million dollars sounds like a lot of money. But have you really thought about it? I mean, really thought about it, calculated it? How many man hours was required to produce it? How many people were involved, how much money went to this and that?
I know 1.8 million dollars sounds like a huge amount of money, but divide it over time, over people, over salaries, rent, taxes, and it becomes much less money. Add to that the fact that the development didn't stop here, they're still working on the Berlin-DLC (which according to some could be a year away) for patches, and additional fixes to the game, that admittedly is full of flaws.
Of course we could say, well they wanted four hundred grand, so they should've made it on that budget. Others say that there are games out there made by smaller studios (even one man studios) that are more advanced, and on lower budgets. Perhaps there are, I don't know. But neither do you. You're just speculating using hypotheticals that are based on hunches or imagined preconceptions. That might work well for everyday casual conversation, but is hardly something to discredit a game studio on.
On the other hand, I think that HBS have been disingenuous with certain things during the process, they kept the backers out of the loop, and screwed them over, particularly over the DRM-free/DLC-deal. The studios justifications weren't satisfactory, and there are glaring faults within the saving-system, and a main storyline that feels a bit rushed at the end (I agree with you there). But a mismanagement of the kickstarter-money, or a greedy group of people who turned the extra money into personal gain, I sincerely doubt it. If you say it is, and call it a fraud, then show us some evidence to support that statement. That's how it works.
Just speculate a bit...
15% tax?
5% to kickstarter?
100K+shipment to send the gifts to the backers?
Someone said Microsoft charges 600K for a development license (look her for example: http://www.shadowrun.com/forums/discussion/27595/anyone-seen-a-cost-breakdown-of-a-video-game-somewhere/p1 )
20 developers involved, with an average salary of, what? 3 grand a month?
20 x 18 x 3000, that's one million dollars alone (excluding insurance, employer costs, taxes, etc.).
Just think things through before you throw sentences like:
| Quote: | | "There simply isn't 1.8m USD worth of content here any way you slice it." |
1,8 mil in development costs for a game is breadcrumbs relatively.
Yes, yes I'm back.
Somewhat.
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| Posted: Sat, 27th Jul 2013 03:33 Post subject: |
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| fisk wrote: | | Immunity wrote: |
However, I can't help but feel that these developers are cutting corners and stuffing their pockets full of Kickstarter money rather than spending it wisely. There simply isn't 1.8m USD worth of content here any way you slice it. The music was great, but there's not much of it. Same goes for the sound/spell effects. Not sure where all that money is going, but it wouldn't surprise me if someone's filling their pockets. |
Everyone is of course entitled to their opinion. Though presenting an opinion and backing it on some sort of reasoning or fact is usually prudent.
1.8 million dollars sounds like a lot of money. But have you really thought about it? I mean, really thought about it, calculated it? How many man hours was required to produce it? How many people were involved, how much money went to this and that?
I know 1.8 million dollars sounds like a huge amount of money, but divide it over time, over people, over salaries, rent, taxes, and it becomes much less money. Add to that the fact that the development didn't stop here, they're still working on the Berlin-DLC (which according to some could be a year away) for patches, and additional fixes to the game, that admittedly is full of flaws.
Of course we could say, well they wanted four hundred grand, so they should've made it on that budget. Others say that there are games out there made by smaller studios (even one man studios) that are more advanced, and on lower budgets. Perhaps there are, I don't know. But neither do you. You're just speculating using hypotheticals that are based on hunches or imagined preconceptions. That might work well for everyday casual conversation, but is hardly something to discredit a game studio on.
On the other hand, I think that HBS have been disingenuous with certain things during the process, they kept the backers out of the loop, and screwed them over, particularly over the DRM-free/DLC-deal. The studios justifications weren't satisfactory, and there are glaring faults within the saving-system, and a main storyline that feels a bit rushed at the end (I agree with you there). But a mismanagement of the kickstarter-money, or a greedy group of people who turned the extra money into personal gain, I sincerely doubt it. If you say it is, and call it a fraud, then show us some evidence to support that statement. That's how it works. |
If this is what they produced with $1.8m, what would the state of the game look like with the 400k they originally targeted? One music track? Two sound effects?  The only people that earned their keep on this project are the programmers and writers - the visuals and sound/music just isn't there (one or two good music tracks admittedly  )
The whole point of fraud is that it's concealed, and the average Joe/customer is none the wiser. Of course there's no evidence (easily found at least - without access to financial records - and Enron proved how reliable those are), but that doesn't mean that stuff can't smell right.
Although, considering I haven't backed it I suppose I don't really have a right to moan. If I had backed it however, I'd be scratching my head.
I can never be free, because the shackles I wear can't be touched or be seen.
i9-9900k, MSI MPG-Z390 Gaming Pro Carbon, 32GB DDR4 @ 3000, eVGA GTX 1080 DT, Samsung 970 EVO Plus nVME 1TB
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fisk
Posts: 9145
Location: Von Oben
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| Posted: Sat, 27th Jul 2013 03:36 Post subject: |
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I don't mind your scepticism. But the idea that $1,8m is a lot of money in game development is a misconception. Take GTA4 for example, it cost like 50 times as much. The majority of the cost doesn't go into music tracks or sound effects, it goes into salaries.
Yes, yes I'm back.
Somewhat.
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| Posted: Sat, 27th Jul 2013 03:43 Post subject: |
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If you want a good example to compare look at this.
http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/2128128298/expeditions-conquistador/posts/496361
70.000 k$ for Expeditions: Conquistador
Vs.
1.800 000 k$ for Shadowrun Returns
Its 25 times the budget and tbh i think Expeditions: Conquistador is a much better game. Only lacking some in GFX compared to SR.
I bet you a big amount that Wasteland 2 and Project eternity (comparable budget with SR) will be much better games and that will prove that this studio, maybe not committed fraud, but have utilized the money in a inefficient way.
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| Posted: Sat, 27th Jul 2013 03:54 Post subject: |
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Agreed.
Expeditions: Conquistador is a good example of a kickstarter game. They didn't ask for huge amounts of money and yet were able to deliver a very solid game.
Also I feel the same thing about Wasteland 2. What we have seen so far from Wasteland 2 shows us a real game with a lot of depth and most importantly exactly what was asked.
Shadowrun so far has not delivered for me and while it's not exactly bad I just find it very mediocre and I can't even imagine how I would feel if I wasn't into the shadowrun universe at all
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| Posted: Sat, 27th Jul 2013 03:56 Post subject: |
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You cannot compare with Expeditions: Conquistador as it was in a much advanced state in development when Kickstarter campaign was released.
| Quote: | For the last six months we've been plugging away at making Conquistador the kind of deep and engaging experience that we want it to be, but we're going to need your help to make it across the finish line.
We've already completed all our core game systems (dialog, combat, world navigation, trading, party management) and finished the first of our two planned campaigns. We're really excited with how the game is coming together and are looking forward to expanding what we've come up with into a full-fledged experience. |
As far as I know Shadowrun started from "ground zero" with Kickstarter.
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| Posted: Sat, 27th Jul 2013 03:58 Post subject: |
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Maybe not but I still doubt the guys who made expeditions had already used 1.5+ millions and were then asking for spare change in the line of 70k. Most likely that game costed about 150k-200k and still delivered a better experience than Shadowrun.
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| Posted: Sat, 27th Jul 2013 03:58 Post subject: |
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| fisk wrote: | | I don't mind your scepticism. But the idea that $1,8m is a lot of money in game development is a misconception. Take GTA4 for example, it cost like 50 times as much. The majority of the cost doesn't go into music tracks or sound effects, it goes into salaries. |
This.
Artist and programmers are expensive. Very.
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fisk
Posts: 9145
Location: Von Oben
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| Posted: Sat, 27th Jul 2013 04:02 Post subject: |
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I like that comparison (Expeditions Conquistador and Shadowrun Returns), and I think that it is obvious why the latter requires more money and the former less. The complaints that have befallen Shadowrun are just compounded with E:C, the graphics are much worse, less diverse, 3D-models are terrible by comparison. The art of the faces in E:C are fine. But the core of the game is alltogether simpler.
I would also say that the fact that we get a very powerful editor, tons and tons of assets (have you even looked at how many assets are available with Shadowrun Returns?) added the complexity of the RPG-element (with all the mechanics required) dialogue, rulesets, modability, I think that it is obvious why it cost more to develop. Whether it makes it a better game though is disputable. I've been playing role playing games since the 80:ies (tabletop, freeform, computer games, etc.) and TO ME Shadowrun is better (in spite of its many flaws).
To compare Wasteland 2 and Project Eternity with Shadowrun however is kind of impossible, since none of them have been finished.
Yes, yes I'm back.
Somewhat.
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| Posted: Sat, 27th Jul 2013 04:07 Post subject: |
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| Roger_Young wrote: | You cannot compare with Expeditions: Conquistador as it was in a much advanced state in development when Kickstarter campaign was released.
| Quote: | For the last six months we've been plugging away at making Conquistador the kind of deep and engaging experience that we want it to be, but we're going to need your help to make it across the finish line.
We've already completed all our core game systems (dialog, combat, world navigation, trading, party management) and finished the first of our two planned campaigns. We're really excited with how the game is coming together and are looking forward to expanding what we've come up with into a full-fledged experience. |
As far as I know Shadowrun started from "ground zero" with Kickstarter. |
Im not sure if SR started from 0, maybe they did maybe they didn't.
But yes that explains the HUGE discrepancy. But i still think (and hope) that W2 & PE will be much better games than this.
It depends on how you look at it tho, if you look at this game as more of a mod-tool with little story content its more understandable, but even so, it still feels kinda cheap. Its still hard to say as kickstarter is so young, but i have a feeling you can make more with that kind of money. Time will tell.
Last edited by KeyserSoeze on Sat, 27th Jul 2013 04:10; edited 1 time in total
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