|
|
| Page 1 of 2 |
fisk
Posts: 9145
Location: Von Oben
|
 Posted: Sat, 14th Jul 2012 17:18 Post subject: The defining moments who made you who you are today |
|
 |
If you had to pick three events in your life who made you who you are as a person today, what would they be, and what did they mean to you - what did they change?
For me the first would be growing up with an alcoholic parent, and the separation between my parents. First of all it taught me a lot about where I stood morally and what I needed to do in life to not become the miserable failure my father is. It has affected me seriously in how I treat people (eg. if they keep being a nuisance to me, I just tell them I'm not interested and move on (did the same to my biological father)). It also made me extremely straightforward, watching my mother give that man opportunity after opportunity that were wasted away, being diplomatic and trying to sugar-coat things. Reality was that he was the scum of the earth and needed that crass cut-off.
The second was getting my first computer, it was a silly old thing (most of you wouldn't know the brand), but it started something with me, I've been a hardcore "computer guy" since I was 7 pretty much (27 years now). Computers gave me the interest in computer graphics, design, gaming, music, and all that. I can't imagine myself without a computer. I'm that guy people call up when they need advice or help, which also made me social and gave the opening into teaching. My job right now is being responsible for running a high school program on a private IT School. I teach photography, game design and design. It's pretty cool.
The third one that has defined me who I am was my curiosity, I've always been curious, I took things apart and wanted to learn how things work. I read a lot of books, I studied at university for 7 years, I went out into the woods and learned a lot from my grandfather, My mother grew up at a farm, and spending a lot of time in the woods, killing and cutting up everything from fish to chicken, I was curious about a lot of shit, and it sometimes got me in trouble, I always wanted to know as much as possible about things like photography, design, MMA, etc. - it got me into training martial arts (Jiu-Jutsu and Taekwondo) and it will keep me looking to understand stuff.
So, what about you?
Yes, yes I'm back.
Somewhat.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Sat, 14th Jul 2012 17:23 Post subject: |
|
|
That last part.. Are you Dexter Morgan by any chance?
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Sat, 14th Jul 2012 17:26 Post subject: |
|
|
Your number 3 was not an event. Interesting thread though, let me participate:
1. My older brother getting his first computer. I was always around when he used it and learned everything he did and soon surpassed him.
2. Getting to know a bunch of guys and attending weekly meetings. It took me quite some time to understand everything happening in the background, but leaving that group really helped me to understand a lot of things and it was a very important decision to not be a part of this group anymore.
3. Meeting my wife. Yes it was very tough, but I was also very weak. She taught me to value myself more and gave me a lot of self confidence. In the last 2-3 years I mentally grew more than in the 15 years before that.
I'll move this in general chatter fisk.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
garus
VIP Member
Posts: 34197
|
| Posted: Sat, 14th Jul 2012 17:29 Post subject: |
|
|
snip
Last edited by garus on Tue, 27th Aug 2024 21:43; edited 1 time in total
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
fisk
Posts: 9145
Location: Von Oben
|
| Posted: Sat, 14th Jul 2012 17:40 Post subject: |
|
|
| huxanomaly2 wrote: | | That last part.. Are you Dexter Morgan by any chance? |
Nope, just a regular dude. I ate (well, grilled it first) everything I killed and cut up. But yeah, biology was fascinating. I had nothing against cutting a cow eye open or a frog, etc. in Biology classes in school.
Yes, yes I'm back.
Somewhat.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ClaudeFTW
Posts: 5074
Location: Bucharest, Romania
|
| Posted: Sat, 14th Jul 2012 17:42 Post subject: |
|
|
1. The time I was bullied in middle school because of my family's financial situation. It's made me cynical and, to some extent, hateful of people who are wasting money away just for the sake of it.
2. My first real relationship. She taught me how to overcome my social awkwardness and cynical personality. She taught me to take pride in every little thing I do and how to be a good, forgiving person. It is because of her I am rarely offended by other people, and even when I am, I get over it quite easily.
3. There are two things here. First, the guys with which I grew up. Out of a group of ~10 friends which grew up together, there's only two of us left that haven't seen the inside of a prison cell. Me and my next door neighbor. Some were caught for dealing drugs, other for stealing from people's homes (even mine, once. some friends, huh?). And the other is my current group of friends. It all started when I was playing Lineage 2 in 2006, and met this awesome guy. We went out for some beers because we were the only ones from Bucharest and soon enough I met the rest of his group. People which turned out to be extremely awesome. Always helpful, always there to help if there's anything wrong. Always meeting on Saturdays for BBQ's or going out in The Old Town.
My past isn't that great, but I am thankful that, for the moment all is well. A bit more money wouldn't be that bad, but what can you do 
R7 2700x @4GHz / MSI B450 Tomahawk / beQuiet! Dark Rock 4 / 32GB @3000 MHz / MSI RTX 2060 Gaming Z / Samsung 850 EVO 250GB / Western Digital 1TB / Fractal Design Meshify C Dark / SuperFlower Leadex Gold 650W / DELL whatever 27 inch IPS
I usually stream stuff: http://www.twitch.tv/claudeftw
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
WaldoJ
VIP Member
Posts: 32678
|
| Posted: Sat, 14th Jul 2012 18:12 Post subject: |
|
|
they haven't happened to me yet. lol 
| Sin317 wrote: | | I win, you lose. Or Go fuck yourself. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Ankh
Posts: 23350
Location: Trelleborg
|
| Posted: Sat, 14th Jul 2012 18:36 Post subject: |
|
|
My brother bringing home punks & Skins and playing oi music.
And getting my first c64 / watching my first horror movie .
shitloads of new stuff in my pc. Cant keep track of it all.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
tonizito
VIP Member
Posts: 51440
Location: Portugal, the shithole of Europe.
|
| Posted: Sat, 14th Jul 2012 18:52 Post subject: |
|
|
It didn't involve me directly, but a pretty serious accident my sister had when she was 7yo which almost left her without any sight on her left eye.
My parents had to travel a lot with her to get proper medical help so there were lots of times when I had to look after myself, which was a bit hard at times for a 11 yo kid.
I think it ended up making me a bit of a loner, for good and bad.
Building my first computer ( in... dunno, 1998 or something? ) from a set of four desktops that had been decommissioned over on my father's workplace. Ignited my interest in all of this, and ended up helping me get the (somewhat poor) job that I have today more than anything I've ever learned on highschool/uni.
I'm missing a nice lady for my 3rd moment, hope I'm as lucky as Pumpy was/is. 
| boundle (thoughts on cracking AITD) wrote: | | i guess thouth if without a legit key the installation was rolling back we are all fucking then |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Sat, 14th Jul 2012 19:14 Post subject: |
|
|
1.) Deployed military experiances
2.) Divorced parents
3.) Backpacking/camping for two months straight in Montana.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Sat, 14th Jul 2012 20:35 Post subject: |
|
|
1997. My first pc. I had nes before but fuck that.
(Duke Nukem3d, quake, hexen, heretic, blood and plebty of other ! then in 1999 Unreal and it's music defined my taste in demoscene music and music overall)
2008 - gf
3080 | ps5 pro
Sin317-"im 31 years old and still surprised at how much shit comes out of my ass actually ..."
SteamDRM-"Call of Duty is the symbol of the true perfection in every aspect. Call of Duty games are like Mozart's/Beethoven's symphonies"
deadpoetic-"are you new to the cyberspace?"
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Sat, 14th Jul 2012 21:08 Post subject: Re: The defining moments who made you who you are today |
|
|
| fisk wrote: | If you had to pick three events in your life who made you who you are as a person today, what would they be, and what did they mean to you - what did they change?
For me the first would be growing up with an alcoholic parent, and the separation between my parents. First of all it taught me a lot about where I stood morally and what I needed to do in life to not become the miserable failure my father is. It has affected me seriously in how I treat people (eg. if they keep being a nuisance to me, I just tell them I'm not interested and move on (did the same to my biological father)). It also made me extremely straightforward, watching my mother give that man opportunity after opportunity that were wasted away, being diplomatic and trying to sugar-coat things. Reality was that he was the scum of the earth and needed that crass cut-off.
The second was getting my first computer, it was a silly old thing (most of you wouldn't know the brand), but it started something with me, I've been a hardcore "computer guy" since I was 7 pretty much (27 years now). Computers gave me the interest in computer graphics, design, gaming, music, and all that. I can't imagine myself without a computer. I'm that guy people call up when they need advice or help, which also made me social and gave the opening into teaching. My job right now is being responsible for running a high school program on a private IT School. I teach photography, game design and design. It's pretty cool.
The third one that has defined me who I am was my curiosity, I've always been curious, I took things apart and wanted to learn how things work. I read a lot of books, I studied at university for 7 years, I went out into the woods and learned a lot from my grandfather, My mother grew up at a farm, and spending a lot of time in the woods, killing and cutting up everything from fish to chicken, I was curious about a lot of shit, and it sometimes got me in trouble, I always wanted to know as much as possible about things like photography, design, MMA, etc. - it got me into training martial arts (Jiu-Jutsu and Taekwondo) and it will keep me looking to understand stuff.
So, what about you? |
Very interesting topic.
First one, is the same as your first. Alcoholic parent, divorce soon after. With the addition that after 2 years the alcohol killed him. Moved around a lot after that and was subjected to physical abuse.
Second, physical and mental torture. Won't get into that one. It's made me a very hateful person, which i never got over.
Third one, is difficult to pin down exactly. It's something between the realization that i am no different than my deceased father, as i have had my share of alcoholism and the addition that i will never be able to fit in in todays society, thanks to how brutal and antisocial my behavior is.
Just waiting for a reason, i suppose.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Sun, 15th Jul 2012 04:49 Post subject: |
|
|
Last edited by Interinactive on Tue, 5th Oct 2021 04:05; edited 1 time in total
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
BonerUK
Posts: 2496
Location: Liverpool UK
|
| Posted: Sun, 15th Jul 2012 10:02 Post subject: |
|
|
1. My first pc
2. Locked up in military jail
3. Meeting Wife
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
TSR69
Banned
Posts: 14962
Location: Republic of the Seven United Provinces
|
| Posted: Sun, 15th Jul 2012 18:16 Post subject: |
|
|
Having read a few stories by people who did not have it easy but found strength to accomplish something (which is great), did not really inspire me to write my own story, Rage did.
1. Getting adopted at age 22 months (I remember it). I got an adoption mother who was physically and mostly mentally abusive. Who beat and threatened me into submission and from age 3 I remember her telling me that I was the child she did not want to have.
2. Age 12 or 13, realising that everything is a competition and no one is my friend.
3. Age 33, realising none can help and choosing social isolation.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Sun, 15th Jul 2012 19:53 Post subject: |
|
|
1. first pc in the house in the late 90's. Shaped my interests and hobbies. also made me more antisocial. Im not really comfortable with people and i think being introduced to a pc at an early age (about 6 i think) made me like that.
2. parents put me to a private school at the age 11. People from my old school arent doing that well now. My new school was much better. There were some bad bits due to puberty, but last 3-4 years in that institution were really good. We had teachers who were always friendly and helpful. Annoying dipshits dropped out. it's a small school with 300 students so everyone pretty much knows everybody's face at least. did well on my exams and am on my way to becoming a medical doctor.
3. last rejection. made me tougher and a bit more cynical
i5-3570k @4.4gHz, MSI GTX 970 GAMING 4g OC'd, MSI z77a-g45, Corsair Vengeance 8gb 1600mHz, Corsair TX650 PSU, Crucial M4 128gb, WD 1.5 TB HDD, Seagate 1TB HDD, LG 27MB85R-B 1440p
RSI name: ctulu
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
vaifan1986
Posts: 4640
Location: Birthplace of the necktie.
|
| Posted: Sun, 15th Jul 2012 21:29 Post subject: |
|
|
1. Age 12: Started masturbating
2. Age 14: Finally said goodbye to religion and told my folks I didn't believe in any gods.
3. Age 24: Finding out that my oldest cousing to whom I always looked up to and was my personal hero, has been cheating on his wife.
Micek:
i7 4790K @ 4.6GHz- Gigabyte Z97X-Gaming 3 - 980 WF3 \o/ - 16GB Corsair - WD 4TB - Mountain of SSDs - Dell UltraSharp U2414H 24''
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Mon, 16th Jul 2012 00:44 Post subject: |
|
|
Great thread, and congratulations on posting to all the people who seem to have had a very harsh life. So I'll post too:
1. Started taking dancing lessons at age 13. You know, Waltz, ChaCha and all that. Me and my friends were huge PC nerds at the time and some girls in our class convinced us to go with them (naturally, I had a crush on one of them) so we went even though we thought it was gay. Changed me forever, learned how to properly speak with girls, got proper posture, better way to dress and lots of new friends. Also got a great girlfriend from there at age 15.
2. Parents broke up when I was 18, couldn't even get myself to tell my friends about it for another 2 years. Came out of nowhere, had a good family life before that. Ever since that I have the feeling that I can't really rely on anyone and that I have to be able to do things myself. Don't get me wrong, I still am a huge nerd, I just don't show this side when it's not appropriate.
3. Girlfriend and me split up at age 23, had been together for 8 years. It's not really the breakup that further shaped me, but the period afterwards. Went out a lot more, made more friends, even took up a side-job as a barkeeper.
After each break-up (2 and 3) I shut myself in and played soothing, good, old computer games for a while, but I never succumbed to it. I keep looking forward and rarely give myself in to nostalgia.
As with many people here, getting my first PC should probably come first, but even though I do study Computer Science and plan on chosing IT as my career field, I feel it does not define my character and personality. At age 13 all I could talk about were computer things, but this slowly went away, and now I even feel awkward when people ask me about 'nerd' topics in a social setting.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
spankie
VIP Member
Posts: 2958
Location: Belgium
|
| Posted: Mon, 16th Jul 2012 01:13 Post subject: |
|
|
1) My mum being fucked up when I was a child. Of course she didn't do it on purpose, but i think I was a little bit of a weird kid because of it. But then again, it made me who i am, so yeah well, turned out positive eventually.
2) My ex gf in university. She was really hot, sexy, cool, party-ish. She took me to a lot of cool parties and around hip people and really pushed my confidence way up. Although it did not last forever (only 3-4 years), it was a really good experience. I went out more, enjoyed life way more than before, relaxed way more than before. hah, she'd be really glad if she read it here because i never told her afterwards... but shhh, she shouldn't get credit for the only good thing she did as she was a real fuckup in general 
3) mountaineering really changed my life as well. it's just an amazing way to spend holidays, live on the edge, make all the 'daily misery' very relative, be totally isolated. It's the only place where i am really really truly happy. I can sit 2-3 h on a mountain top, all alone, just watching a bird or watching a cloud pass over. Always look forward to it, keeps me going.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Mon, 16th Jul 2012 03:57 Post subject: |
|
|
Three things? uhm.. childhood beatings, retarded parents, drinking in high school, drugs after that, isolation, dropping out of university, the ignorance of the few people that i care about.. so many happened i cant even tell what changed me the most. There's a huge gap between the person that i became and who i really am and im very confused. Do things happen for a reason and are we supposed to embrace the scars or do we just keep things as memories and continue life without letting them change us ?
ASUS TUF B550M-PLUS | RYZEN 5600x | RTX 3060TI | 16GB DDR4
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Mon, 16th Jul 2012 04:40 Post subject: |
|
|
1. My mother getting me into gaming, she gave me my one passion (family aside, naturally) in life from the youngest age and I've embraced it my whole life. Some would say to the detriment to everything else, but egh.. nothing else ever interested me and at least my hobby affects nobody but me. The only decent thing my father ever did for me was get me into computers, and I built my first from cast-off spare parts when I was 10 (or 11, I forget) Being close to the one person who knows me as well as my wife does; my elder brother.
That defined my joys.
2. Physical abuse from a step-father, my father cheating on my mother (and every woman he's been with since) resulting in my strong moral stance against infidelity, in and out of foster homes and children's homes, boarding school, muggings from scum in the street, betrayal from friends, my ex having an abortion, never accomplishing anything, never feeling like anything I did ever actually meant something, hating myself and everything around me, yet still wanting to do whatever I possibly could to make people around me feel the worth I never felt for myself, to help as much as I can.
That defined my character.
3. Meeting my future wife online, then deciding right there that all I ever want for the rest of my life is to right by her. Leaving England, moving to another country, taking the risks in order to spend my life with my missus. Getting married. Being accepted into the family. Making her happy 
That's my future.
.. and that's me. Gaming and family. That's all I care about and no doubt all I'll ever care about ^_^
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Mon, 16th Jul 2012 08:39 Post subject: |
|
|
Naming 3 distinct things that defined me today is kinda hard. I mean, there are lots of stuff that happened, and on everyday basis something happens that change me, and shapes me. I certainly don't think that I am a complete person, and there is so much that will happen that will impact my life.
It's a process, what can I say
But I could say that there are some major events that shaped my future I guess.
1. Moving from my home town (Novi Sad, Vojvodina) because my mother is Croatian, and my dad is Hungarian, so we weren't 'desirable' during the war times. I moved to Zagreb in 94' and a lot has happened since then. This is ofc big thing, because it changed my life completely. I ended up in a new place, with no one familiar, but I managed.
2. Ditching religion. I realized that something isn't quite right about it. Plus the priest at the local church was (and still is) a giant dickhead. Because, even tho ppl have no bread on the table, you can still donate to your church. Fuck you!
That changed the way I think, and probably steered me into physics. To a place where they said: nothing is certain, and you need to test everything! Only with proof and evidence can you be sure of something (and in that you can't really be 100% sure, because our knowledge is ever expanding)
3. The third one is kinda in a process, I'm still figuring that out (well, not so much figuring out, as kinda hiding it from my parents). Last year I kinda snapped. I was alone. I had no one whit whom I could share my feelings. It sucked and made me fall into a depression, which I haven't felt since high school. I wanted to die because I was really miserable.
And than it hit me: you idiot! By standing and doing nothing, nothing will happen! And so I admitted to myself that I am gay. Simple. Like that. I found out a site to meet other ppl, and since then my life has been kinda great
I met loads of new ppl, I met my, now ex, bf. I told my sister, and she was really cool with it, which meant the world to me. I told my friends, and they were also cool with it. The only obstacle are my parents. Because I still depend on them, and even tho I'm sure they wouldn't overreact, I am still not comfortable telling them. That will have to wait a bit
So these are kinda the three big things, that defined me the way I am today. But there are loads, and loads of things that happened and made me into who I am now. And, as I've said, that process is still going on
"Quantum mechanics is actually, contrary to it's reputation, unbeliveably simple, once you take the physics out."
Scott Aaronson | chiv wrote: | | thats true you know. newton didnt discover gravity. the apple told him about it, and then he killed it. the core was never found. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Mon, 16th Jul 2012 09:37 Post subject: |
|
|
And even though you might not consider us close friends, you were still able to talk about it to us I can't imagine how this must be for you, but I'm happy for you, that you found the courage.
And to be honest, that is also great news for all the croatian hetero guys out there, as you are quite handsome and now they don't need to compete with you for the nice girls 
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Mon, 16th Jul 2012 11:12 Post subject: |
|
|
1) Growing up in the ghetto
2) Realizing that giving too much of a fuck is unhealthy and useless
3) Alcohol
4) weed
5) Being poor most of my life
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Mon, 16th Jul 2012 11:17 Post subject: |
|
|
| dingo_d wrote: | | And so I admitted to myself that I am gay. Simple. Like that. I found out a site to meet other ppl, and since then my life has been kinda |
Oh you'll feel right at home here. Ixi! Give this man a lap dance!
 Spoiler: | Put it in my tab |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Rasmus
Posts: 462
Location: Pik Kozlova snipin' with voldY
|
| Posted: Mon, 16th Jul 2012 11:23 Post subject: |
|
|
|
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Mon, 16th Jul 2012 11:28 Post subject: |
|
|
1. the war (it never changes)
2. realizing there is no god
3. wife and kids
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Mon, 16th Jul 2012 12:44 Post subject: |
|
|
| PumpAction wrote: | And even though you might not consider us close friends, you were still able to talk about it to us I can't imagine how this must be for you, but I'm happy for you, that you found the courage.
And to be honest, that is also great news for all the croatian hetero guys out there, as you are quite handsome and now they don't need to compete with you for the nice girls |
I consider ppl from the hump very close, that's why I cannot leave this place xD And I realized that if I'm not going to talk about it, that things are only going to be worse, so I'm trying to be as honest as possible
And thanks for the support Pumpy ^^
"Quantum mechanics is actually, contrary to it's reputation, unbeliveably simple, once you take the physics out."
Scott Aaronson | chiv wrote: | | thats true you know. newton didnt discover gravity. the apple told him about it, and then he killed it. the core was never found. |
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
| Posted: Mon, 16th Jul 2012 13:07 Post subject: |
|
|
1. Never been able to learn what trust is as my father ditched me and my mom at around my 2nd year but thought it was fun to take her back and ditch her every so often for another 8 years.
2.Not being able to trust my mom in making a good choice for a parent as she chose a verbally abusive arsehole to live with when I was around 10.
3. When I was 16 desperately trying to get out of a bad situation calling on my father to get me out of there which he did not do as he was afraid of responsibility and also because he is a narcissistic fuck that only cares about himself and I pretty much derailed after that and have not been able to pick up the pieces since.
4.Every time I get into stressful situations (work/study) my body gives up on me by getting all kinds of fucked up autoimmune diseases.
Biggest lesson I learned is that everything in life comes down to luck and there is no real choice in our lives.
I am 40 now and I am disgusted by myself and my life and for that matter the society I live in.
The one thing in my life that brings me some sort of joy is the ability to download games movies and series and comics and books, I read a lot about economics and everything else that has my interest.
tl:dr life sucks but at least the internet keeps me from going insane.
Per Ardua Ad Astra
Last edited by Anticasper on Mon, 16th Jul 2012 15:04; edited 1 time in total
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
aevis
Posts: 522
Location: Absurdia
|
| Posted: Mon, 16th Jul 2012 14:37 Post subject: |
|
|
If i were to only take into account 3 things that changed who i am the most ( and ignoring everything in between ) they would prolly be the following:
1. Bits from my childhood ( was about 12 yo ) when my dad decided to tell my mum he was abandoning us for another woman, and the ensuing silent sobbing coming from the kitchen, which directed me to the same attitude Sabin described towards infidelity. My dad never did carry on with his decision but i wish he did. The issue reappeared later and my lack of respect towards him continued growing with time.
2. Meeting the single most interesting person one can imagine over the internet about 7 years ago. He is older than me so i sometimes consider him as my rolemodel, but it has truly changed my perception about pretty much everything. Things from the notion of friendship to musical preference (used to really be into the metal scene, and now i've been learning flamenco guitar for about 5 years ^_^) , were altered with time due to this single connection i made with a dude off the internet.
3. Time spent in university, which was for me an absolute blast. Even if i had to retake my last year in order to finally get my bachelor's degree about 1 week ago, i must say that the people i met in these 5 years were truly my kind of people (including my current gf for 2 years). I really disliked highschool and it changed me into an antisocial motherfucker for it's duration ( maybe other factors were to blame for this as well ) but university made me open up to people and stuff i really enjoy doing. I think being congratulated for having an interesting subject for my thesis by one of the most hardcore teachers at my uni must've been one of the moments i am most proud of by now.
I must say that most of my friends and quite a few people off the humps from what i see have quite a bad relationship with their father. I am most scared of this, i do want kids eventually, but damn it i am scared of becoming the image of my father or falling into the opposite extreme as a parent.
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
| Page 1 of 2 |
All times are GMT + 1 Hour |
|
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot vote in polls in this forum
|
Powered by phpBB 2.0.8 © 2001, 2002 phpBB Group
|
|
 |
|
