Well I find that very hard to believe, since you have praised the visual style of the GAME ITSELF. The pre-rendered cutscenes are identical, video quality aside
There's just one thing missing in order for our world to be truly "cyberpunk".
It's not dirty, gritty and poluted enough yet.
But true cyberpunk arrived without anyone noticing.
we have the ridiculous army of energy corporate drones calling themselves 'climate skeptics', who have enough power to stop any progress we try to make to stop it
the same group attacking nuclear power from the other end, the only real threat solution to both, power crisis and climate change
you don't need a destroyed world to be cyberpunk.. just the road paved to it with greedy intentions
realistically i can't think of anything that would actually pollute the world properly
nuclear terrorism, sure
viral terrorism, perhaps
gene modified fuel crops that escape containment and mix with food crop worldwide causing an entire food group to disappear, certainly
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Back to the augmentation bit.
digital memory storage? You'd basically be willing to replace parts of your brain?
Can you still consider yourself "human" (whatever that actually implies) if you replace parts of your body without any medical indication with mechanical/technological replacement parts?
i don't need to replace any part of my brain
just put a small transcoder in there that takes bioelectric signals and communicates it with an external computer
possibly something the size of a small usb-stick you could have hanging around your neck
though by that time i'm sure it's all small enough to fit inside your brain without damaging it
i don't think calling people 'human' is the right question
what is human today is very different from human 10000 years ago
i think absolute labels are a bit naive
if i upload my consciousness into a computer and live online as software, am i still human?
biologically, no, but i'm certainly still a person
but then that brings up another question.. if i copy myself onto another computer, am i one person in two computers or two persons?
if i delete the other one, is that murder of a full person, partial lobotomy or just discarding data?
this is also what always bothers me about time travel stories.. people forget that duplicates are full human beings and are merrily killed off because there's a spare copy around
Well I find that very hard to believe, since you have praised the visual style of the GAME ITSELF. The pre-rendered cutscenes are identical, video quality aside
Not exactly identical. The character models are somehow "smoother", but they look like shit IMO
TWIN PEAKS is "something of a miracle."
"...like nothing else on television."
"a phenomenon."
"A tangled tale of sex, violence, power, junk food..."
"Like Nothing On Earth"
They use in-game assets, so doesn't that make them identical by nature? :\ I agree the visuals aren't top of the line, but they're impressive nonetheless and really set the tone of the game.
The two live-action trailers, as well as the original SquareEnix CGI one from way-back-when, are all awesome -- but those ingame, pre-rendered, ones are just downright hideous. Not the style or the design, but the quality.
Sadly, you are right. But we can hope that in the released game, they can be of much higher quality,no? After all this was a beta for game.review-testing, not for looking at the same (amazing) CGIs again.?
Epsilon wrote:
Meanwhile the people of that generation will call those guys relics, and not move with the times when everything is auto fucking.
if i upload my consciousness into a computer and live online as software, am i still human?
biologically, no, but i'm certainly still a person
but then that brings up another question.. if i copy myself onto another computer, am i one person in two computers or two persons?
if i delete the other one, is that murder of a full person, partial lobotomy or just discarding data?
In that case, at least for me, you cease to be human. The moment your consciousness stops existing in your body is the moment you become... not an AI, what's the proper word for this? You might still be considered a being but human? No way.
On the other hand what is the difference between a human consciousness uploaded to a computer and an AI? (Thinking sci-fi "perfect" AI not, dunno, video game AI).
There's none, so either the AI is considered human (which clearly it cannot be because it was entirely artifically created, or the human has to be considered something more akin to an AI than a human.
Sadly, you are right. But we can hope that in the released game, they can be of much higher quality,no? After all this was a beta for game.review-testing, not for looking at the same (amazing) CGIs again.?
I truly hope so mate, because they were hideously poor quality. I guess we'll find out soon! Less than a month!! Weeee... I'm all giddy with excitement
Sadly, you are right. But we can hope that in the released game, they can be of much higher quality,no? After all this was a beta for game.review-testing, not for looking at the same (amazing) CGIs again.?
I truly hope so mate, because they were hideously poor quality. I guess we'll find out soon! Less than a month!! Weeee... I'm all giddy with excitement
In that case, at least for me, you cease to be human. The moment your consciousness stops existing in your body is the moment you become... not an AI, what's the proper word for this? You might still be considered a being but human? No way.
On the other hand what is the difference between a human consciousness uploaded to a computer and an AI? (Thinking sci-fi "perfect" AI not, dunno, video game AI).
There's none, so either the AI is considered human (which clearly it cannot be because it was entirely artifically created, or the human has to be considered something more akin to an AI than a human.
ofcourse it's not human.. 'human' is a biological term
but there is a real distinction between digitized humans and AIs
we could call both a person but if an AI was transferred to a human body, we couldn't really call it human
an AI is a logic construct that either was built to be one or emerged from logic and data
human brains had a genetic template and are very much reliant on brain chemistry to do so many things
not to mention all kinds of genetic cruft in there, like appreciation of music or sex.. or anything for that matter
the computer being uploaded to would have to have a brain chemistry 'emulator' of some sort
without that life in a computer would be quite boring for the digitized and any people left outside
In that case, at least for me, you cease to be human. The moment your consciousness stops existing in your body is the moment you become... not an AI, what's the proper word for this? You might still be considered a being but human? No way.
I disagree, because, imo, part of what makes us really human is our ability to reason, to forgive and to adapt, maybe even to destroy. Technically, not a human, I agree, but morally...I think the mind would still be human, if the medium in which it was uploaded would allow for the same behavior as one would have with a biological brain.
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I highly doubt/hope the animations and ingame trailers in the beta were final. That would be a major fuck up for a game that obviously got so much love. Someone at Square Enix would probably say "WTF is this shit? Who made this goddam trailer?! Bring me his head, HIS HEAD!".
I highly doubt/hope the animations and ingame trailers in the beta were final. That would be a major fuck up for a game that obviously got so much love. Someone at Square Enix would probably say "WTF is this shit? Who made this goddam trailer?! Bring me his head, HIS HEAD!".
I highly doubt that most, if not all, of the animations in the leak are NOT the final ones. And I don't care. Because the leak was awesome. The full game will be awesome.
Why is being human better/more interesting/whatever than being non-human?
If you can't answer - then why do you care?
First, this has gone off the topic I tried to bring up a bit. I was thinking along the lines of enhancements/augmentations not pure consciousness to robot/data upload.
What is the alternative to being human? Well non human of course but what does that actually mean? That's what we're trying to figure out.
And last why would i have to explain why I think that being human is superior to being non-human? I am human and in the 25 years of my life I have to come to like this quite a bit. Why would I want to give that up? (Thanks to good we have no aliens on earth or this would sound horribly racist xD ). Again there's the question of how do you define human / non-human?
Why is being human better/more interesting/whatever than being non-human?
If you can't answer - then why do you care?
First, this has gone off the topic I tried to bring up a bit. I was thinking along the lines of enhancements/augmentations not pure consciousness to robot/data upload.
What is the alternative to being human? Well non human of course but what does that actually mean? That's what we're trying to figure out.
And last why would i have to explain why I think that being human is superior to being non-human? I am human and in the 25 years of my life I have to come to like this quite a bit. Why would I want to give that up? (Thanks to good we have no aliens on earth or this would sound horribly racist xD ). Again there's the question of how do you define human / non-human?
25? Youre youger than i thought rek. ANW in my 2 cents: being human is not exclusively biological, its about the choices and feelings we have while HUMAN RACE, ALL OF US (love, fear, anger, regret..) that is what makes US human, not just the shell, and i love my shell).
IMAGINE a alien stoled your body, its still human? an alien entity controlling your body? NO, its alien. Albeit it has your biological body.
Maybe some augmented, would be more HUMAN than some not augment that i know..
PTorment says it better than i:
"what can change the nature of a MAN?"
Epsilon wrote:
Meanwhile the people of that generation will call those guys relics, and not move with the times when everything is auto fucking.
25? Youre youger than i thought rek. ANW in my 2 cents: being human is not exclusively biological, its about the choices and feelings we have while HUMAN RACE, ALL OF US (love, fear, anger, regret..) that is what makes US human, not just the shell, and i love my shell).
IMAGINE a alien stoled your body, its still human? an alien entity controlling your body? NO, its alien. Albeit it has your biological body.
Maybe some augmented, would be more HUMAN than some not augment that i know..
PTorment says it better than i:
"what can change the nature of a MAN?"
First off love the PTorment reference - and it really fits at this point.
Second: Not sure why you'd have figured me older but I guess that's a sort of compliment?
Anyway. But why aliens? The question is humanity regarding augmentations / cybernetic enhancements - even uploading your conscience to some sort of data storage / internet like place.
As far fetched as all that sounds imo it's still more likely than an alien taking over your body.
But what I really wanted to say is. Of course our "shell" is not what defines us as human but it is what defines our perception of the world - thereby our perception of other people (humans if you will) and thereby influence the way we act and react towards other people.
Now imagine getting optical replacement ( a common thing in cyberpunk literature/games/movies)
Now all of a sudden you see more information than before (doesn't really matter what). Surely that changes how you perceive the world and it will (maybe not outright but sooner or later) change the way you behave.
Not saying this'll make you inhuman at once. Maybe not at all but it changed something, something about the very core of who you are. And at the very core we are human, aren't we?
Maybe we just need to re-define and re-evaluate what it means to be human or it could lead to a detachment from humanity. Can I tell? Sure as hell not.
This is, after all pure speculation and I'm not trying to force my thoughts on this onto anybody. Just trying to make people think
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But we can hope that in the released game, they can be of much higher quality,no? After all this was a beta for game.review-testing, not for looking at the same (amazing) CGIs again.?
