i , as i guess many others here, been playing fps' (online) since now well 10 years (some have probably longer).
And sure there is the occassional kiddie admin server, but you know what, in the end, you always end up finding a couple servers with good admins/good applied server rules (auto admin). And the people playing there with the right skill/behavior matching your own. I had those servers for cs, css, dod, cod1,2,4, quake 3 , bf1942,bf2 and (shortly lol) bf2142 .... there are/have been tons and tons of good servers out there and i never had any issue finding them ...
So i consider my complaint more than applicable.
And like it has been said over and over ... the 2 aren't mutually exclusive... which , in my very humble opinion, defeats every single last "IWNet wait and see" defender ...
Heh sabin, now would be the perfect time to point at raging people.
But I thought the points were well laid out why we THINK it is bad idea.
To summarize:
9v9-fact. Yes, some people like, some dont. The problem is we get no choice. I personally do not even look at servers with less than 30 people. I find servers (oh yes another beautiful PC function), with 30 people or more, on a map that I know is good for it (not the stupid lot map), and with low ping. Thankfully there are a lot of those servers.
Ping. Developers themselves said 100. Again, I do not even look at servers with more than 75 ping because in my experience, it is not smooth for me.
No mod support. This is defiantly not a biggy for me, but still I enjoy those sniper maps in WaW, custom maps, and even some balancing some servers have.
Not being able to chose a server. I have a lot of favorited servers. All servers have something unique that I like. Some are good for mindless spamming, others are good for tactical gameplay, and others I just like people playing there.
Those are the biggest points why I am going to sit out the initial buy and see how it plays out.
You are defending console style matchmaking, nothing wrong with that. Enjoy it as much as you want, it is just we don't want it being shoved into our faces. We chose pc games because we like what comes with it. I have xbox 360 and ps3, and I enjoy those consoles, but if I want to play online, I go to pc because IMO it is a lot better.
And this is why we "cry" and "bitch".
Sig too big. -Nothing is too big for Fedor. Expect a nasty armbar.
I have yet to see anyone tell me why they should remove server browsers and dedicated servers when they're not even in the way of matchmaking and P2Pservers so please enlighten me from a gamers point of view and not the corporate muppet.
And no the usual "i like matchmaking and if you don't you're a retarded 6 year old" won't do.
IIRC games like Counter-Strike and Battlefield series are PLAGUED TO THE FUCKING BRIM with piece of shit control freak server admins that bitch and cry, kick and ban all day long because they are 12 year pieces of pathetic shit that can't win.
Yes, all the servers are like this absolutely. Have you heard of this feature called favorites? You know when you find a server you like you add it there and you stick to them. Big fucking whoop, wah wah wah there are shitty servers, there are thousands of servers and no problem to find good ones so don't throw it out of proportion.
sTo0z wrote:
The only legitimate concern I have seen thus far is the modding scene
How about latency? When I'm used to playing on steady low ping then I don't fucking want to switch to some shitty laggy player hosted games.
but if I want to play online, I go to pc because IMO it is a lot better.
.
+1
and to think that some people thinking the Live is the "best Online experience"
they are only saying that to not feel suckers for paying for that,
you can find for *free* on PC better online services.
I'm not fanboy,I myself probably going to buy 360 next year,but not for Online gaming.
Guys, don't laugh at Stooz, he doesn't know any better...
... He plays on the 360.
Oh well, guess I'd better apologize for raging, I have some food in my stomach now.
Cartoon, you're an epic guy, don't hate me.
Sabin, too, I love you guys.
It's too bad you're making a big deal out of this. Personally from what I've played, the player count is real nice. Wait until you run into the riot shields, you tell me how many little bastards you want running around with those.
The map sizes and layout fit the server count, it never even crossed my mind once that they settled for the "lowest denominator", it's just how they made the game, and it feels right.
I hope you guys decide to jump in anyways, I don't see how a lack dedicated servers affects you guys, whatsoever, but I guess I just don't understand.
Carry on gents, at least I gave you something to rage at (me) in place of reading more boring stuff about people thinking they can get copies to work already.
It's too bad you're making a big deal out of this. Personally from what I've played, the player count is real nice. Wait until you run into the riot shields, you tell me how many little bastards you want running around with those.
No doubt the game is going to be amazing, the only thing we're raging about; is the stripping of features we've come to know, and love. It's not *just* about dedicated servers, it's also about customisation and - at the very least - being able to keep a favourites list, or have a server browser... and the absolute biggest annoyance is the reliance on player-hosted games. Urgh.
Quote:
I hope you guys decide to jump in anyways, I don't see how a lack dedicated servers affects you guys, whatsoever, but I guess I just don't understand.
That was just our point... you're having at go at us for being, understandably, pissed off at what's been cut - but you don't even understand it yourself. If you enjoy playing the game on the 360 with match-making, then that's fine! That's how you play and that's how you like it .. just don't slam us because we pine for our dedis and server lists Besides, of course we'll all get it anyway - just like we'll all get L4D2 (even Leo, I bet he gets it before the year is out ) We're just not instantly jumping on the preorder "ZOMG IT'S GONNA BE THE BEST GAME EVAH!!!11" train. Being treated like cast offs kinda makes one a tad miffed, so I - for one - will get the game for $20 off a key warehouse, rather than paying Craptivision $70+
It's too bad you're making a big deal out of this. Personally from what I've played, the player count is real nice. Wait until you run into the riot shields, you tell me how many little bastards you want running around with those.
No doubt the game is going to be amazing, the only thing we're raging about; is the stripping of features we've come to know, and love. It's not *just* about dedicated servers, it's also about customisation and - at the very least - being able to keep a favourites list, or have a server browser... and the absolute biggest annoyance is the reliance on player-hosted games. Urgh.
Quote:
I hope you guys decide to jump in anyways, I don't see how a lack dedicated servers affects you guys, whatsoever, but I guess I just don't understand.
That was just our point... you're having at go at us for being, understandably, pissed off at what's been cut - but you don't even understand it yourself. If you enjoy playing the game on the 360 with match-making, then that's fine! That's how you play and that's how you like it .. just don't slam us because we pine for our dedis and server lists Besides, of course we'll all get it anyway - just like we'll all get L4D2 (even Leo, I bet he gets it before the year is out ) We're just not instantly jumping on the preorder "ZOMG IT'S GONNA BE THE BEST GAME EVAH!!!11" train. Being treated like cast offs kinda makes one a tad miffed, so I - for one - will get the game for $20 off a key warehouse, rather than paying Craptivision $70+
Well I mean, you're vastly offended that they cut something out.. but, at the end of the day, it's all about getting into the game to enjoy it right?
Server browsing and game joining should be what you're doing the least. Playing the game should be what you're doing the most. Dedicated servers, or match making, whatever, as long as you get into the game fast and easy.
I can appreciate the idea that you think dedicated servers are important.
a) Because the hardware and connection is probably nice.
b) There are going to be people you know and enjoy playing with.
But that's being replaced with forming and squad of your friends and all joining a server together, which is awesome.
As for connection issues, I just don't see how you can complain before you've even tried it out, you know? The match making always sends me to decent connections every time.
Like I said the important thing is that you get into games, and match making does it. The fact it's 360 isn't the problem. I'd enjoy match making on anything. This isn't a console vs. pc thing.
Stooz, let me give you my perspective on the whole dedicated servers and why I need it so much. Israeli ISPs suck ass badly. So, while I might have good ping to US or Europe at some points, I get 200ms ping on others. With a server browser this is very easy to remedy - sort, pick, etc. And usually there are quite good dedicated servers rented by Israeli gaming sites for people to play, so this means I get excellent results. What Dildovision has done with this is to force me to play at 100-200 ms pings with people that have 15-40 ms pings. You can't argue with me on this, because this is how it is. Also, all the fun I had in servers with a lot of players (much more than 19) will now not be possible. You might argue with me that this is how it's mean, but I don't care, I had the options in COD4 to either play in big servers or normal ones, here I don't.
I don't think anyone is disputing that the SP will be good.
You say games are for fun, but if Dildovision is not allowing me to have fun as I see fit (as opposed to their definition of fun), I will complain here. My comment about you playing on the 360 stands, in that whole time, you have only experienced this way of playing. You are from the US, you will mostly have good pings. So if you find this acceptable, that is good for you. But don't come here and force your views on others. Fact is a lot of people are angry about this, and believe it or not, there is a reason for it; we're not just spoiled PC gamers.
Stooz, let me give you my perspective on the whole dedicated servers and why I need it so much. Israeli ISPs suck ass badly. So, while I might have good ping to US or Europe at some points, I get 200ms ping on others. With a server browser this is very easy to remedy - sort, pick, etc. And usually there are quite good dedicated servers rented by Israeli gaming sites for people to play, so this means I get excellent results. What Dildovision has done with this is to force me to play at 100-200 ms pings with people that have 15-40 ms pings. You can't argue with me on this, because this is how it is.
Oh really? I'd love to know how you know this. How many match made games of MW2 have you played so far? Oh, what's that? Zero? That's what I thought.
Quote:
Also, all the fun I had in servers with a lot of players (much more than 19) will now not be possible. You might argue with me that this is how it's mean, but I don't care, I had the options in COD4 to either play in big servers or normal ones, here I don't.
You had the option because the game was designed for it. Here, the game is NOT designed for it. You had fun because they made the game work with those specific numbers of players, not because it was that exact number...
My point is, you're acting like they CUT the number in MW2 just to screw you over. This is NOT a big numbers game by design. They didn't play on big numbers and then just randomly take it out. Numbers don't make the game, DESIGN makes the game. If you want big numbers for the sake of big numbers, go play a game that is designed for it.
What are you talking about? How many players did you have max on the MW1 console version? That's what the maps were DESIGNED for. Higher player numbers were only for the PC, and maps were not DESIGNED for it (this is what made it fun).
But I get it, you console gamers will never get it. You like playing only what someone DESIGNED for you. Modding to you is blasphemy and sin, god forbid someone mess with the DESIGN.
sTo0z wrote:
Oh really? I'd love to know how you know this. How many match made games of MW2 have you played so far? Oh, what's that? Zero? That's what I thought.
Yes, they gonna make some miracles, and suddenly everyone will have 10ms pings. Maybe they include satellites for 100GB/100GB internets with 10ms pings for everyone to enjoy too.
Come on, a little common sense.
It's funny to see this topic jump 8 pages a day these past few days. A lot of hype even though PC buyers are so against it now. A see a bunch of posts hating on consoles. I do agree that matchmaking for the PC was the shit (until this whole non-dedicated server BS), but I really don't have the option to play it on PC anymore. All of my friends have consoles and I have to choose the console route to play with my friends and it sucks. All of my friends are too cheap to upgrade their pc's. They force me to buy and play this game on console. I love the first modern warfare multiplayer, but as a PC gamer, I have no choice... everyone is slowly converting to consoles!
What are you talking about? How many players did you have max on the MW1 console version? That's what the maps were DESIGNED for. Higher player numbers were only for the PC, and maps were not DESIGNED for it (this is what made it fun).
But I get it, you console gamers will never get it. You like playing only what someone DESIGNED for you. Modding to you is blasphemy and sin, god forbid someone mess with the DESIGN.
Again, and get this through your increasingly thick skull. THIS IS NOT A CONSOLE VS PC ISSUE. God forbid the idea I've ever played something on the PC right? I'll cut the suspense for you, I have.
Yes, us console players.. despite the fact I have a very nice gaming pc that I use for gaming. I know it's hard for you, apparently, but please try and comprehend that I'm not talking system here. I know you'd love it to be, because it helps fill your empty argument, but it's not working, sorry.
And I don't see what modding has to do with us discussing your enjoyment of the VANILLA version of the game. One second you're talking player numbers, and then you bring in the idea of modding for some reason... Yes, some common sense, how about that?
iNatan wrote:
sTo0z wrote:
Oh really? I'd love to know how you know this. How many match made games of MW2 have you played so far? Oh, what's that? Zero? That's what I thought.
Yes, they gonna make some miracles, and suddenly everyone will have 10ms pings. Maybe they include satellites for 100GB/100GB internets with 10ms pings for everyone to enjoy too.
Come on, a little common sense.
lol, right, because technology has never improved in this world, nothing has EVER gotten better, right? No one has ever improved anything!
You seem to not get it. VANILLA MW1 was not DESIGNED for large number of players either. Did you have 32vs32 players on the console? No? This is why I mentioned modding. We are talking about stuff that was in the first and is not here, are we not?
sTo0z wrote:
THIS IS NOT A CONSOLE VS PC ISSUE.
You are correct. The console itself, as in the machine and the hardware, is not the problem. They could run anything the PC can run. The problem lies somewhere else.
sTo0z wrote:
lol, right, because technology has never improved in this world, nothing has EVER gotten better, right? No one has ever improved anything!
BTW, why are we arguing about it? You have your opinion and I (and 186,000 others) have mine. We are both entitled to one. What's the point of arguing?
Everyone is talking about the poor pings and low player counts that IWnet is going to bring but what about connectivity? IW's argument about making the game more accessable by using the same matchmaking as RTS multiplayers doesn't make sense, how many posts on their official forums are going to be from people unable to host games because their router is blocking everything. Most rts games I've played are terrible for people with unconfigured routers.
Well, if they integrate UPnP, this shouldn't be an issue for most.
But it's still P2P And I can't remember any PC game out there still alive after 2-3 months after release having p2p
FC2
Fuel of war
Vegas 1,2
OPF dragon rising
.... The list is long !
Client/server is essential now days for PC! and it's should be for console as well. It's almost 2010 and only two more years until D day! (2012) at least give us great online experiences
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Besides, of course we'll all get it anyway - just like we'll all get L4D2 (even Leo, I bet he gets it before the year is out 
