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Veki
Posts: 381
Location: Croatia
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upstart_69
Posts: 1094
Location: Right behind you!
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 Posted: Wed, 14th Nov 2007 13:14 Post subject: |
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Sadly, DAMMIT FTL once again. If they can't even beat Nvidia's budget chip then the smashing new features like 10.1 that won't even come to be useful in games for AT LEAST a year from now won't make a damned bit of difference.
Core i7 920 @ 3.8Ghz | 6GB OCZ DDR3 8-8-8-24 @ 1600mhz | eVga x58 Mobo | 2 x eVga GTX 460 SLI | Intel X25-M + 3x Seagate + WD Black = 2.75TB | X-Fi Titanium | PCP&C Silencer 750 | G15 KB | G5 Mouse | G35 Headset | Z-5500 Digital | Samsung T260HD
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| Posted: Wed, 14th Nov 2007 16:45 Post subject: |
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Well so much for AMD ever getting back on their feet if they keep fucking up like this. Not only does the 8800GT run faster, it's smaller and im sure it runs hell of a lot cooler with less power draw
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Veki
Posts: 381
Location: Croatia
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| Posted: Wed, 14th Nov 2007 16:48 Post subject: |
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| Posted: Wed, 14th Nov 2007 16:55 Post subject: |
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Nice, guess they didn't want to do SLI and embarrass them.
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Surray
Posts: 5409
Location: Europe
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| Posted: Wed, 14th Nov 2007 19:04 Post subject: |
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| SpykeZ wrote: | | Well so much for AMD ever getting back on their feet if they keep fucking up like this. Not only does the 8800GT run faster, it's smaller and im sure it runs hell of a lot cooler with less power draw |
well.. I dunno, that's a bit extreme..
I think the 3870 is pretty good for the price. the performance is only a little behind the GT, which is absolutely awesome for the price, so the 3870 still offers good price/performance ratio.
the GT is indeed smaller, but it's louder and generates more heat than the 3870.
the 3870 uses a small manufacturing process.
The 3870 is also the better choice for multi-card setups. With 8800 GT SLI you're more limited in what motherboards you can use, as you can only use nvidia's chipset and no P35 chipset.
I also read that 8800 GT SLI gets seriously hot, and I mean really really seriously hot. A test revealed that 8800 GT SLI may get as hot as 100°C using the stock cooler.
So yeah... the performance could be better, and 3870 is a bit misleading because it's not really much faster than the HD 2xxx cards, but it offers good performance for the price and is worthy competition for the GT.
The 3870 is also cheaper than the 8800 GT where I live, so it's worth considering.
DX10 performance still seems to suck though :-)
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LeoNatan
☢ NFOHump Despot ☢
Posts: 73196
Location: Ramat Gan, Israel 🇮🇱
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Surray
Posts: 5409
Location: Europe
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| Posted: Thu, 15th Nov 2007 00:05 Post subject: |
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heh yeah... it's kinda sad. the best ATI can do is merely mid-range for nvidia.
once nvidia starts updating their other cards (G92 GTS for example) ATI will be left in the dust.
I hope they'll come up with something better soon, they're seriously getting their asses kicked.
Likot Mosuskekim, Woodcutter cancels Sleep: Interrupted by Elephant.
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Nakitu
Posts: 1144
Location: Croatia
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| Posted: Thu, 15th Nov 2007 10:28 Post subject: |
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I think that ATI is concentrated on dual gpu solutions and that all work is going in that direction. We will see at start of new year if i am right.
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LeoNatan
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Posts: 73196
Location: Ramat Gan, Israel 🇮🇱
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| Posted: Thu, 15th Nov 2007 11:48 Post subject: |
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| Nakitu wrote: | | I think that ATI is concentrated on dual gpu solutions and that all work is going in that direction. We will see at start of new year if i am right. |
I prefer to buy a single, cheaper solution from nVidia rather than having Crossfire/SLI which is not supported by many games, especially the quick-buck ports.
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Nakitu
Posts: 1144
Location: Croatia
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| Posted: Thu, 15th Nov 2007 12:17 Post subject: |
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I wasnt talking about sli i was talking about multicore gpu. Its same as C2D or Athlon x2. Multi core in one gpu. Thats what Nvidia and ATi are doing ATM and thats the future. I wouldnt buy new gfx now, its waste of money.
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upstart_69
Posts: 1094
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Nakitu
Posts: 1144
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LeoNatan
☢ NFOHump Despot ☢
Posts: 73196
Location: Ramat Gan, Israel 🇮🇱
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| Posted: Thu, 15th Nov 2007 12:53 Post subject: |
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No no, the entire GF9 series is supposed to be multicore ready, but I'm not sure first models will arrive with multiple cores.
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upstart_69
Posts: 1094
Location: Right behind you!
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| Posted: Thu, 15th Nov 2007 14:09 Post subject: |
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Just to clarify I said WAITING on mutlicore gpu is stupid. Not multicore gpus. And 4 Monthes in this technology biz is like a billion yrs, anything could happen.
Core i7 920 @ 3.8Ghz | 6GB OCZ DDR3 8-8-8-24 @ 1600mhz | eVga x58 Mobo | 2 x eVga GTX 460 SLI | Intel X25-M + 3x Seagate + WD Black = 2.75TB | X-Fi Titanium | PCP&C Silencer 750 | G15 KB | G5 Mouse | G35 Headset | Z-5500 Digital | Samsung T260HD
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| Posted: Thu, 15th Nov 2007 16:40 Post subject: |
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HD3870 will be my next card once i buy a whole new system , just waiting for phenom x3.
About the benchmarks , 12500 compared to the 13800 of the 8800gt really isnt bad at all, both are amazing cards.
Also the poor AA performance seems to fixed , and even does better at it then the 8800gt.
The price is spot on when you compare prices, going for the 250 dollar you posted , but i read ATI wants to have it around 200 very soon with 3850for 150dollars, i saw HD3870on european sites for 215 euro today, but they are launch prices , should go down soon , and should to make it even more competetive.
Also even if you feel 8800gt for $270 is the better deal , you simply cant buy one now and wont be able to for a while, as only 50000 were produced first batch, there will be 150 000 HD38xx available on launch with half a million up to end of the year, one of the reasons ATI can go way lower on price.
55nm doesnt only produce less heat, use less power etc. but also allows for good OC capabilities , saw a screenshot of HD3870 clocking from 775 to 865 on stock cooling which gave 14.5k in 3dmark06.
While many jumped on the 8800gt card to buy train( not claiming its not a great card ) Nvidia shot its own foot, low end will be dominated by the 2600xt priced below $100 and the 3850 in the mid end for 150-190 range , nvidia simply doesnt offer any competition.
in the high mid end its a tough competition between 8800gt and 3870,but with no 8800gt available.
So that leaves the 8800gts/gtx/ultra for the $300+ market. why would anyone still buy these? even as hardcore nvidia fanboy you realize the 8800gt performs faster or same speed for alot cheaper , ASUS EVGA & complain about sitting on alot of stock... so they rely on the 8800gt...
As to the comment that ATI cant do better then a high midend card, the 0-300 dollar market is where most profit is made + cards are sold, its very important you succeed in that range, also the days are over like 3-4 years ago where you needed a 450-500 dollar card as a gamer to play your games on high settings, today you can play all your games with a 1950pro flawlessly besides crysis ofcourse.
I didnt like 2900xt, so it was worth waiting for this one.
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Nakitu
Posts: 1144
Location: Croatia
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| Posted: Thu, 15th Nov 2007 17:12 Post subject: |
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| Stefan F wrote: | HD3870 will be my next card once i buy a whole new system , just waiting for phenom x3.
About the benchmarks , 12500 compared to the 13800 of the 8800gt really isnt bad at all, both are amazing cards.
Also the poor AA performance seems to fixed , and even does better at it then the 8800gt.
The price is spot on when you compare prices, going for the 250 dollar you posted , but i read ATI wants to have it around 200 very soon with 3850for 150dollars, i saw HD3870on european sites for 215 euro today, but they are launch prices , should go down soon , and should to make it even more competetive.
Also even if you feel 8800gt for $270 is the better deal , you simply cant buy one now and wont be able to for a while, as only 50000 were produced first batch, there will be 150 000 HD38xx available on launch with half a million up to end of the year, one of the reasons ATI can go way lower on price.
55nm doesnt only produce less heat, use less power etc. but also allows for good OC capabilities , saw a screenshot of HD3870 clocking from 775 to 865 on stock cooling which gave 14.5k in 3dmark06.
While many jumped on the 8800gt card to buy train( not claiming its not a great card ) Nvidia shot its own foot, low end will be dominated by the 2600xt priced below $100 and the 3850 in the mid end for 150-190 range , nvidia simply doesnt offer any competition.
in the high mid end its a tough competition between 8800gt and 3870,but with no 8800gt available.
So that leaves the 8800gts/gtx/ultra for the $300+ market. why would anyone still buy these? even as hardcore nvidia fanboy you realize the 8800gt performs faster or same speed for alot cheaper , ASUS EVGA & complain about sitting on alot of stock... so they rely on the 8800gt...
As to the comment that ATI cant do better then a high midend card, the 0-300 dollar market is where most profit is made + cards are sold, its very important you succeed in that range, also the days are over like 3-4 years ago where you needed a 450-500 dollar card as a gamer to play your games on high settings, today you can play all your games with a 1950pro flawlessly besides crysis ofcourse.
I didnt like 2900xt, so it was worth waiting for this one. |
You only forgot one mayor fact. And that is who has the fastest high end card sells more mid and low range cards. Its allways like that because people want fastests card for the money so they think oh ill buy that card because its almost the same as best card only some things were removed to make it cheaper.
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| Posted: Thu, 15th Nov 2007 17:18 Post subject: |
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| Nakitu wrote: | | Stefan F wrote: | HD3870 will be my next card once i buy a whole new system , just waiting for phenom x3.
About the benchmarks , 12500 compared to the 13800 of the 8800gt really isnt bad at all, both are amazing cards.
Also the poor AA performance seems to fixed , and even does better at it then the 8800gt.
The price is spot on when you compare prices, going for the 250 dollar you posted , but i read ATI wants to have it around 200 very soon with 3850for 150dollars, i saw HD3870on european sites for 215 euro today, but they are launch prices , should go down soon , and should to make it even more competetive.
Also even if you feel 8800gt for $270 is the better deal , you simply cant buy one now and wont be able to for a while, as only 50000 were produced first batch, there will be 150 000 HD38xx available on launch with half a million up to end of the year, one of the reasons ATI can go way lower on price.
55nm doesnt only produce less heat, use less power etc. but also allows for good OC capabilities , saw a screenshot of HD3870 clocking from 775 to 865 on stock cooling which gave 14.5k in 3dmark06.
While many jumped on the 8800gt card to buy train( not claiming its not a great card ) Nvidia shot its own foot, low end will be dominated by the 2600xt priced below $100 and the 3850 in the mid end for 150-190 range , nvidia simply doesnt offer any competition.
in the high mid end its a tough competition between 8800gt and 3870,but with no 8800gt available.
So that leaves the 8800gts/gtx/ultra for the $300+ market. why would anyone still buy these? even as hardcore nvidia fanboy you realize the 8800gt performs faster or same speed for alot cheaper , ASUS EVGA & complain about sitting on alot of stock... so they rely on the 8800gt...
As to the comment that ATI cant do better then a high midend card, the 0-300 dollar market is where most profit is made + cards are sold, its very important you succeed in that range, also the days are over like 3-4 years ago where you needed a 450-500 dollar card as a gamer to play your games on high settings, today you can play all your games with a 1950pro flawlessly besides crysis ofcourse.
I didnt like 2900xt, so it was worth waiting for this one. |
You only forgot one mayor fact. And that is who has the fastest high end card sells more mid and low range cards. Its allways like that because people want fastests card for the money so they think oh ill buy that card because its almost the same as best card only some things were removed to make it cheaper. |
thats a sad fact i agree on , also ati changed to 38xx naming cause it sounds "faster" then 2xxx
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poullou
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Location: Internet Express
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Nakitu
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Phluxed
VIP Member
Posts: 4911
Location: Oakville, Ontario, Canada
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| Posted: Fri, 16th Nov 2007 06:50 Post subject: |
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Reviews show this card right around the 8800GT performance at a less cost. I've decided to pick one of these up upon release.
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| Posted: Fri, 16th Nov 2007 08:28 Post subject: |
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Too lazy to find a link but pics of the HD3870 X2 or whatever the fuck, two GPU's on one board similiar to the 7950GX2 are on sites now.
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Surray
Posts: 5409
Location: Europe
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| Posted: Fri, 16th Nov 2007 11:21 Post subject: |
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| Phluxed wrote: | | Reviews show this card right around the 8800GT performance at a less cost. I've decided to pick one of these up upon release. |
yeah it's a good choice, they aren't so bad and the GT's prices are usually above what they're supposed to be at, giving the 3870 a bigger price advantage.
the GT is also sold out all over the world so it should be easier to get a 3870.
Sure, it is slower than the GT, no doubt about it, but people have to keep in mind that the GT is an absolutely incredible performance beast for the price. So the 3870 is almost as impressive as the GT.
Now if the GT wasnt out yet and we'd only have the 3870 for 200$ people would go crazy about it now just as they did with the GT.
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| Posted: Fri, 16th Nov 2007 12:33 Post subject: |
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I still think for straight performance the 8800GT is a better buy, you'd just have to wait until the prices drop with less demand. The GT already beats the 3870 by a good 20-30% not taking into account OC'ing. From the reviews i've checked out the Nvidia card responds incredibly well to overclocking, not so much so the 3800's.
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| Posted: Fri, 16th Nov 2007 13:37 Post subject: |
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| KrAzY-KaMeL wrote: | | I still think for straight performance the 8800GT is a better buy, you'd just have to wait until the prices drop with less demand. The GT already beats the 3870 by a good 20-30% not taking into account OC'ing. From the reviews i've checked out the Nvidia card responds incredibly well to overclocking, not so much so the 3800's. |
im gonna wait till the launch period is over , and the speed difference is around 10%ish.
Till then new drivers will be out and ATI is good at adding a good speed bump to their new cards every month, look how 2600xt improved by almost 30%.
And about OCing , as i typed before 3800s OC like a mother, 55nm ftw
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Surray
Posts: 5409
Location: Europe
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| Posted: Fri, 16th Nov 2007 18:42 Post subject: |
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the 3870 is only about 15% slower on average, and it also costs about 15% less than the GT, so it's a perfectly valid solution if you don't need that much performance.
the 3870 is really good enough for everything.. only thing where you might want a better card is for crysis.
Likot Mosuskekim, Woodcutter cancels Sleep: Interrupted by Elephant.
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| Posted: Sat, 17th Nov 2007 02:11 Post subject: |
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Yeah they are OC'ing it's memory easily 400Mhz +, but my point was that increase doesn't have as big as an effect on performance as OC'ing the 8800GT.
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Phluxed
VIP Member
Posts: 4911
Location: Oakville, Ontario, Canada
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| Posted: Sat, 17th Nov 2007 03:59 Post subject: |
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| KrAzY-KaMeL wrote: | | Yeah they are OC'ing it's memory easily 400Mhz +, but my point was that increase doesn't have as big as an effect of performance as OC'ing the 8800GT. |
I read the opposite on anandtech forums and such... I won't be buying until just after christmas (when my quad core and mobo arrive for $190 now  ). I figure they'll both have slightly lower price points and as stated, the drivers will show the ATI closing in. |
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| Posted: Sat, 24th Nov 2007 15:25 Post subject: |
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anyone able to find it in europe or the usa ( for my buddy) ?
About to order my new rig next week , and not planning to wait a full month just for the videocard , www.geizhalz.at shows some retailers showing 29.11 as date , some show 5.12 as date , 90% doesnt seem to have a clue when they will be in stock again >_<
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