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 Posted: Mon, 16th Jun 2014 16:37 Post subject: |
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I just found out about this game, and came to the conclusion that its cheaper to watch the whole content via a 10min gameplay video then to buy this tech demo. Will look into it in a few years again, their promises sound intriguing.
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| Posted: Mon, 16th Jun 2014 16:42 Post subject: |
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I really want to try this game too, but 65$ for a fucking ugly ship? I'll have to pay 125$ for anything remotly good? 250$ for the new ship shown a E3?
This game is fucking bullshit
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| Posted: Mon, 16th Jun 2014 18:35 Post subject: |
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| deadpoetic wrote: | I really want to try this game too, but 65$ for a fucking ugly ship? I'll have to pay 125$ for anything remotly good? 250$ for the new ship shown a E3?
This game is fucking bullshit |
You do realize that you can get any ship by just playing the game, right?
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| Posted: Mon, 16th Jun 2014 18:38 Post subject: |
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People buy expensive ships because they want to have the option of starting out in a decent ship + buying ships now supports the development of the game.
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| Posted: Mon, 16th Jun 2014 18:39 Post subject: |
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| Wickster wrote: | | deadpoetic wrote: | I really want to try this game too, but 65$ for a fucking ugly ship? I'll have to pay 125$ for anything remotly good? 250$ for the new ship shown a E3?
This game is fucking bullshit |
You do realize that you can get any ship by just playing the game, right? |
NO I DIDNT!!!
Can you even earn money now or is it a planned feature?
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| Posted: Mon, 16th Jun 2014 18:51 Post subject: |
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| deadpoetic wrote: | | Wickster wrote: | | deadpoetic wrote: | I really want to try this game too, but 65$ for a fucking ugly ship? I'll have to pay 125$ for anything remotly good? 250$ for the new ship shown a E3?
This game is fucking bullshit |
You do realize that you can get any ship by just playing the game, right? |
NO I DIDNT!!!
Can you even earn money now or is it a planned feature? |
You will be able to earn test-money in the near future shortly after AC 1.0 comes out, so you can buy stuff in the voyager direct (equipment for your ship).
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| Posted: Mon, 16th Jun 2014 19:01 Post subject: |
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| Wickster wrote: | | deadpoetic wrote: | I really want to try this game too, but 65$ for a fucking ugly ship? I'll have to pay 125$ for anything remotly good? 250$ for the new ship shown a E3?
This game is fucking bullshit |
You do realize that you can get any ship by just playing the game, right? |
The only question is; how much work will it take to get those ships in game? If they can make $100+++ for a ship in the cash shop, there's absolutely no incentive to make them easy to acquire in game and I am absolutely convinced that they won't be. Ships are going to be incredibly difficult to earn without spending real money, because to make it otherwise would be to cut a massive revenue stream for the developers and remember? "servers need money, lol"
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| Posted: Mon, 16th Jun 2014 19:23 Post subject: |
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| sabin1981 wrote: | | The only question is; how much work will it take to get those ships in game? If they can make $100+++ for a ship in the cash shop, there's absolutely no incentive to make them easy to acquire in game and I am absolutely convinced that they won't be. Ships are going to be incredibly difficult to earn without spending real money, because to make it otherwise would be to cut a massive revenue stream for the developers and remember? "servers need money, lol" |
I would give them benefit of the doubt first, though.
They even put cap on how much credits you can buy per day. That tells me they're not looking solely for money. TBH I am looking forward to Squadron 42 a lot more than to the PU part.
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sTo0z
[Moderator] Babysitter
Posts: 7449
Location: USA
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| Posted: Mon, 16th Jun 2014 19:26 Post subject: |
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| sabin1981 wrote: | | Wickster wrote: | | deadpoetic wrote: | I really want to try this game too, but 65$ for a fucking ugly ship? I'll have to pay 125$ for anything remotly good? 250$ for the new ship shown a E3?
This game is fucking bullshit |
You do realize that you can get any ship by just playing the game, right? |
The only question is; how much work will it take to get those ships in game? If they can make $100+++ for a ship in the cash shop, there's absolutely no incentive to make them easy to acquire in game and I am absolutely convinced that they won't be. Ships are going to be incredibly difficult to earn without spending real money, because to make it otherwise would be to cut a massive revenue stream for the developers and remember? "servers need money, lol" |
Again, this is where I get incredibly confused.. there's still the private server option yes? And you can do whatever the hell you want?
If you want to try out a ship, can't you just fire a server up and spawn whatever the hell and check it out?
Do people REALLY only care about the MMO public multiplayer of this game? I can't stand that idea. Only thing I want is the old Freelancer style, mini-universe for me and some friends. |
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| Posted: Mon, 16th Jun 2014 19:35 Post subject: |
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@Wickster
They've not earned any benefit of the doubt from me, especially not after the "one character, you have to pay for more" silliness. The fact that they've put a cap on how many credits you can buy is actually *more* proof of my fears than *less* -- why? Because if you can't buy masses of credits with which to buy ships in game then it forces you to buy ships with real money or struggle to acquire in game credits other ways. That and the fact that by limiting the amount of credits you can buy also makes me feel that the credit-cost of ships is enormous - again, thereby forcing you to take the easy, but expensive, path of buying ships with real money.
No proof, of course, just a feeling that hasn't been dissuaded by anything I've seen of the development so far. The claim of "it's just to raise development funds" means nothing any more, not when they've surpassed $46m and keep on going. How much more funding does this game need? If the game comes out and they haven't priced ships in-game at an astronomical level, and if they either remove the ability to "pay to win" by purchasing ships with real money, or lower the prices to more realistic levels, then I'll happily shut the fuck up and apologise but for now? I feel it's only going to get worse.
@sTo0z
Nope, sadly it seems everything is "account" bound. Credits/ships/etc are all part of your account/player and not server based, at least as far as I can tell. I'm with you though.. absolutely! All I want is a Freelancer-style mini universe for myself to play in - I don't even care about multiplayer 
Last edited by sabin1981 on Mon, 16th Jun 2014 19:37; edited 1 time in total
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| Posted: Mon, 16th Jun 2014 19:37 Post subject: |
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| sabin1981 wrote: | | Wickster wrote: | | deadpoetic wrote: | I really want to try this game too, but 65$ for a fucking ugly ship? I'll have to pay 125$ for anything remotly good? 250$ for the new ship shown a E3?
This game is fucking bullshit |
You do realize that you can get any ship by just playing the game, right? |
The only question is; how much work will it take to get those ships in game? If they can make $100+++ for a ship in the cash shop, there's absolutely no incentive to make them easy to acquire in game and I am absolutely convinced that they won't be. Ships are going to be incredibly difficult to earn without spending real money, because to make it otherwise would be to cut a massive revenue stream for the developers and remember? "servers need money, lol" |
Prices in the pledge store does not equal the the actual cost in-game, Chris Roberts has stated this multiple times. We know that a Constellation (225 $) will be around 60 hours of casual gameplay. They have stated that you will NOT be able to buy a ship directly off the website once the PU launches, you will only be able to buy ingame money, which there will be both a daily cap, and a total cap of.
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| Posted: Mon, 16th Jun 2014 19:38 Post subject: |
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@GeezForce
They said. He said.
Give up a $46m-style funding stream? I'll believe it when I see it, same with the whole "60 hours of casual play" - which doesn't tell us anything. That could be 60 hours of mining the most expensive minerals in the most dangerous areas, it could be anything. We'll just have to wait and see what happens at launch, but the whole "an Aurora could cost 75,000 credits" works out at $75 (credits are $5 for 5000). So a $25 Aurora now will cost 3x more at launch?
Granted this is just an example.. but still....
https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/13249-Letter-From-The-Chairman-18-Million
~edit~
http://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/1rd29f/ingame_ship_prices/
Going by that, and the main forum, just shows that - once again - I'm in the minority and the Yes Men EVE scumholes are dictating development. These people WANT everything to be expensive, they WANT everything to take enormous amounts of work, because then they can gloat and slap each other on the back when they troll and gank everyone.
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locke89
Posts: 2812
Location: Poland
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| Posted: Mon, 16th Jun 2014 19:58 Post subject: |
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| locke89 wrote: | | 3. They will be as open as the main, official server but they will be restriced to small number of simultenous players |
That wouldn't bother me at all, as long as that's the only restriction. Considering how much the game will always cripple machines, I don't suppose many people have the rigs capable of hosting their own servers with large player counts. A clan/forum server with 64-128 players would be nice.
~edit~
Anyway, less negativity (though I prefer to call it "realism"  ) -- here's an interview CR did with VentureBeat today;
http://venturebeat.com/2014/06/16/wing-commander-creator-chris-roberts-shows-off-star-citizen-and-the-new-way-to-fund-aaa-games-interview/
| Quote: |
GamesBeat: Which elements of the game are going to finish first? What targets are you looking at right now?
Roberts: It’s hard to say. This year we’re going to show the first-person combat. We have a couple of big iterations on the Arena Commander, with things like multi-crew ships and some other functionality. Next year we’re going to be showing the planetside stuff. We’re starting Squadron 42, the first set of episodes there. Then we’ll have the persistent universe. We’ll start with a smaller elements, like one system, and then we’ll add more systems and keep on adding until the content’s complete.
The backers should be able to fly around in a small version of a persistent universe toward the end of next year. By the end of next year, the beginning of the following year, everything will be feature and content complete. All along the way, though, they’ll be playing. They can play this, go head to head against other people. That’s kind of the content curve.
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Early 2016 ... damn.
Last edited by sabin1981 on Mon, 16th Jun 2014 21:49; edited 1 time in total
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JBeckman
VIP Member
Posts: 34968
Location: Sweden
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| Posted: Mon, 16th Jun 2014 20:11 Post subject: |
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I think it's mainly 2 and perhaps a bit of 3, I assume it's a bit of 3 because of bandwidth primarily and 2 is because the stand-alone server client likely won't be able to match official content such as events and other stuff the developers could implement directly, also hopefully they won't lag too far behind on updates.
(The downloadable server client might also differ in other regards or be more streamlined to be easier to maintain.)
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Kaltern
Posts: 5859
Location: Lockerbie, Scotland
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| Posted: Mon, 16th Jun 2014 20:55 Post subject: |
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I've lost all hope and interest in this game now. That seems to be happening a lot with gaming right now... Many promises, all DLC 
Playing Valheim every weekday at 10pm GMT - twitch.tv/kaltern
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| Posted: Mon, 16th Jun 2014 21:32 Post subject: |
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| locke89 wrote: |
They simply can't allow the private servers to have as much features as the main server because guess what, noone almost noone would play the main server and everyone would go to some big, private server that would circumvent all this shit regarding monetization.
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i would not play on a official like private server because :
1 -> human nature. top dogs -> server admins + their friends.
2 -> crap /no backup server's -> playing for 1 month, just to start again because of a power failure which wiped their shit server.
probably the only private server i would play is on a instant gratification server. like wow level 99 full gear, no costs, to test things.
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no9999
Posts: 3437
Location: Behind you...
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| Posted: Tue, 17th Jun 2014 11:56 Post subject: |
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Has the community been consulted for anything but stuff like "what funding goal reward do you want next?"
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sTo0z
[Moderator] Babysitter
Posts: 7449
Location: USA
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| Posted: Tue, 17th Jun 2014 13:29 Post subject: |
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| sabin1981 wrote: |
@sTo0z
Nope, sadly it seems everything is "account" bound. Credits/ships/etc are all part of your account/player and not server based, at least as far as I can tell. I'm with you though.. absolutely! All I want is a Freelancer-style mini universe for myself to play in - I don't even care about multiplayer |
Welp, fuck this game. :\ Fooled again!
They make it so hard to support games these days, they tell you a bunch of stuff, and then just change it all on the way. Going to have to go back to waiting for the damn thing to be on the "shelf" before throwing anymore money away... |
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no9999
Posts: 3437
Location: Behind you...
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| Posted: Tue, 17th Jun 2014 14:47 Post subject: |
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Stolen ship are not going to stay in your hangar.
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| Posted: Tue, 17th Jun 2014 16:50 Post subject: |
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https://robertsspaceindustries.com/comm-link/transmission/13951-Flight-Model-And-Input-Controls
Sounds really good.
Still waiting for TrackIR support though...
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Fa4Ta4L
Posts: 394
Location: Netherlands
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| Posted: Tue, 17th Jun 2014 16:59 Post subject: |
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| sTo0z wrote: | | sabin1981 wrote: |
@sTo0z
Nope, sadly it seems everything is "account" bound. Credits/ships/etc are all part of your account/player and not server based, at least as far as I can tell. I'm with you though.. absolutely! All I want is a Freelancer-style mini universe for myself to play in - I don't even care about multiplayer |
Welp, fuck this game. :\ Fooled again!
They make it so hard to support games these days, they tell you a bunch of stuff, and then just change it all on the way. Going to have to go back to waiting for the damn thing to be on the "shelf" before throwing anymore money away... |
Yea but what sabin said is not true though. They did say that you can have private servers and mod them as much as you like. Already with the hangar people used cryengine to show an "fly" ships they didn't own on their account and CIG only responded positively. I'm 95% sure that on private servers you'll be able to fly anything you want instantly if you mod it in or change some settings. They said at the start they can't make TIE fighters and the like because of copyrights but we could do it on private servers if they're modded in. So what would then be stopping anyone to extract the other ships from the game, or duplicate them and run them on a private server anyways. They must know that, they're not stupid. I may be too trusting considering the negativity here lately, but I still believe they want to make a good and fun game, and hold true to their early promises.
Ok, they pushed some deadlines. It sucks but that's game development for you. Yes, paying for more character slots is a pretty shitty move but they didn't make any promises on that beforehand. Will SC turn out worse than they're promising, with some of the gazillion features they're promising never appearing, or only with paid expansions? Probably.
But will they abandon stuff like private servers and modding which they promised from the start, thereby alienating 90% of the early backers that only supported it because of these promises? I don't think so. Yes, probably 50% of all total backers now won't care, but if this turns out shitty I know I won't spend another dime on this game or its expansions, and neither will many others . I never played any of Roberts' earlier games and I don't really understand all the fanboyism but I don't think even his reputation is enough to block the backlash that would occur if he started pulling stunts like that.
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| Posted: Tue, 17th Jun 2014 17:06 Post subject: |
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They've backpedaled quite a bit on what "private servers" mean since the official announcements, now they keep umm'ing and ahh'ing over what you can and can't do. As for running mods on servers, what does that have to do with your account? What does loading SC ships inside CryEngine have to do with ANYTHING regarding the SC universe or profiles? You can only have one pilot unless you buy more, and your account lists what credits and what ships you have on your profile with your pilot. You really think CIG is going to let you join a private server and acquire all the ships? Good luck with that.
The whole "alienate 90% of the early backers" is ridiculous too. Have you seen the forums? Every single thing proposed by CIG gets a massive cheer, no matter how changing it is, so no.. I don't think even 10% of the people posting there would give a toss if they announced no private servers, or huge restrictions on what you can/can't do on them. What backlash? The man can't do any wrong, the company can't do any wrong, the fucking Yes Men Rule by Committee shitass community have made sure of that. He could announce that there will be a monthly subscription (coughpaytowincreditsshipscough) and everyone would cheer and rationalise it as the best solution because "servers need income, lol" - I don't know, I'm just not very trusting at all when it comes to this. Too much has come to light about aspects I simply don't like, or the vile community that dictate how the game should be turned into EVE 2.0, the lack of any concrete information about private servers/modding, the *gross* commercialisation and a whole host of other worries. The game sounded fantastic until they launched that goddamn cash shop and now almost everything sounds like bullshit to me. I hope I'm wrong but so far nothing, absolutely nothing, has convinced me that I am.
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Fa4Ta4L
Posts: 394
Location: Netherlands
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| Posted: Tue, 17th Jun 2014 17:32 Post subject: |
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| sabin1981 wrote: | They've backpedaled quite a bit on what "private servers" mean since the official announcements, now they keep umm'ing and ahh'ing over what you can and can't do. As for running mods on servers, what does that have to do with your account? What does loading SC ships inside CryEngine have to do with ANYTHING regarding the SC universe or profiles? You can only have one pilot unless you buy more, and your account lists what credits and what ships you have on your profile with your pilot. You really think CIG is going to let you join a private server and acquire all the ships? Good luck with that.
The whole "alienate 90% of the early backers" is ridiculous too. Have you seen the forums? Every single thing proposed by CIG gets a massive cheer, no matter how changing it is, so no.. I don't think even 10% of the people posting there would give a toss if they announced no private servers, or huge restrictions on what you can/can't do on them. What backlash? The man can't do any wrong, the company can't do any wrong, the fucking Yes Men Rule by Committee shitass community have made sure of that. He could announce that there will be a monthly subscription (coughpaytowincreditsshipscough) and everyone would cheer and rationalise it as the best solution because "servers need income, lol" |
If you could point me a link to where they backpedaled that'd be great, because if that's true then I've missed it. I do actually think it'll be possible to host a private server and fly with any ship on there, as in the latest info I've read on it (which, admittedly, I only know from memory and couldn't give you a link to, and is at least 1 year old), this was said to be possible. I've not seen any evidence to the contrary since, so then I'll trust my latest information on the subject.
Furthermore about the early backers. I do remember many people during the early (kickstarter) crowdfunding campaign being really happy when private servers were announced. And I do think that out of the let's say 60.000 first backers that backed during that campaign a lot would be quite angry if it were dumbed down significantly (maybe not 90%, but I would think definitely 75%.
You're talking about the people posting on the forums now, which is probably a completely different group of people (which does contain many of those early backers). You're probably right when saying that the ratio of Yes Men to non-Yes Men is probably 1:9 in the people that are actually vocally posting in the forums. That doesn't mean that non-Yes Men are only 10% of the total backers though. I think most of these have just given up trying to shout against the "Yes Men".
If you look at the $46 mil poll asking to vote for or against additional stretch goals I think it's a reasonable assumption that most Yes Men would vote for and most Non-Yes Men against. According to this poll that would make it 1:2 or 1:3 at worst (counting No Preference as Yes Men).
I agree about the cash shop. It turned me off the game as well. But I do think the private servers will come out as announced until I see evidence otherwise. Like I said, maybe I'm too trusting.
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| Posted: Tue, 17th Jun 2014 17:46 Post subject: |
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There's no one single occurrence that I could point to, just the overall talk and the responses people get on the forums. There's a lot of "well.. you won't be able to run a full server" or "it will be limited in some fashion" and "we'll talk more once the game is further along in development" that kind of talk is just PR bullshit for "don't expect anything even close to SC, we'll maybe let you fly around a small piece of the universe with a handful of ships, if we feel like it" -- as a counterpoint to you; I'm just not trusting enough. The fact that the "non Yes Men have given up trying to shout against the Yes Men" just makes the whole thing even more unpalatable, because any voice of dissent or contrary to popular opinion, just gets drowned out by the scumbags. What happens when the "majority" stay silent? The vocal minority wins and judging by how CR keeps thanking the community for being "so supportive" and all the "great feedback" he's getting, it sounds to me like they're winning hard. Anyone raising any criticism is shot down. I'd still like to know what magical systems everyone has that apparently runs this so well as to have CR thanking everyone and going on about how the DFM is a success so far.
As for the poll? "Shall we continue asking for more money?" and a staggering 54% said YES. You don't see something wrong with that? Those same 54% were likely the ones that cheered and okayed the "we're going to charge for additional character slots" - so what happens when the NEXT monetisation aspect rears its head? The same 54% will cheer and give it their blessing. You may think this sounds like a fantastic way to build a game but to me it's nothing less than terrifying, because I don't fucking want EVE 2.0 and if CIG keeps building based on "community feedback" then that's exactly what it's going to be; EVE 2.0 with a cash shop and some fancy physics that only a handful of people out there can even play (unless you happen to own a magical GPU that plays it on highest settings at sonic framerates) I hope you're right, I hope they still stick to their initial KS promises and that we get full offline/private server support and that we never have to pay a penny to the cash shop, I hope we can adjust the economy and the values and mod the shit out of the game in our own ways .. but considering how much money they've made so far, I don't see CIG relinquishing their revenue stream any time soon, and making fully-feature private servers available to anyone, for free, does exactly that.
Last edited by sabin1981 on Tue, 17th Jun 2014 18:02; edited 1 time in total
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| Posted: Tue, 17th Jun 2014 18:01 Post subject: |
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sabin, i still think you are making a bigger deal that it really is with those extra char slots.
extra characters slots -> personalized npc to use on your ship. same npc you can hire ingame. (without the posibility to change the apeareance.).
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