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 Posted: Thu, 24th Nov 2011 21:43 Post subject: |
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Pey
Posts: 5601
Location: Argentina
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| Posted: Sat, 26th Nov 2011 14:50 Post subject: |
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Played a couple of games and I really dont like it, at all. The game mechanics feel, how do i put it, not hardcore at all, controls are too stiff, maybe i´m used to hon way too much, but my first impression was not as good as I hoped. I know it´s a beta, but coming from valve i expected more.
Tons of animations missings (items, heroes, store), the UI is huge, camera too freaking close, oh well. Back to hon for now. But of course ppl will play it anyway cause it´s valve and has the dota "trademark".
Seasonic 1000w Planitum - TT Level 10 GT - ASUS M5E - i7 2600k @ 5.0ghz - 16GB Patriot Viper 3 - Dell u3011 - EVGA GTX 980 @ SLI - SSD Samsung EVO 250GB - 16TB W.D. - G19/G13 @ Roccat Kone XTD - Razer Vespula - Xonar Phoebus @ Vulcan ANC/Corsair 2100 Vengeance - Logitech G51
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| Posted: Sat, 26th Nov 2011 15:08 Post subject: |
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Haven't really followed the game's development. I assume, you're all playing a beta?
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| Posted: Sat, 26th Nov 2011 15:23 Post subject: |
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| Pey wrote: | Played a couple of games and I really dont like it, at all. The game mechanics feel, how do i put it, not hardcore at all, controls are too stiff, maybe i´m used to hon way too much, but my first impression was not as good as I hoped. I know it´s a beta, but coming from valve i expected more.
Tons of animations missings (items, heroes, store), the UI is huge, camera too freaking close, oh well. Back to hon for now. But of course ppl will play it anyway cause it´s valve and has the dota "trademark". |
Then to be fair you should compare it to the HoN 2009 beta 
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| Posted: Sat, 26th Nov 2011 15:25 Post subject: |
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Well, it doesn't say "beta" anywhere, but it is definitely a beta. the main menu isn't even finished yet, there are some placeholders and I noticed some bugs. leaderboards aren't working and you don't level up - you're always lvl 1, no matter how many games you win.
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| Posted: Sat, 26th Nov 2011 15:57 Post subject: |
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I think that technically it's alpha, since the content is not complete yet.
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Pey
Posts: 5601
Location: Argentina
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| Posted: Sat, 26th Nov 2011 16:00 Post subject: |
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Hon´s beta was definetelt better than dota 2´s beta. I play hon since july 2009 and back then it was way more polished.
Seasonic 1000w Planitum - TT Level 10 GT - ASUS M5E - i7 2600k @ 5.0ghz - 16GB Patriot Viper 3 - Dell u3011 - EVGA GTX 980 @ SLI - SSD Samsung EVO 250GB - 16TB W.D. - G19/G13 @ Roccat Kone XTD - Razer Vespula - Xonar Phoebus @ Vulcan ANC/Corsair 2100 Vengeance - Logitech G51
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| Posted: Sat, 26th Nov 2011 17:44 Post subject: |
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| Pey wrote: | Played a couple of games and I really dont like it, at all. The game mechanics feel, how do i put it, not hardcore at all, controls are too stiff, maybe i´m used to hon way too much, but my first impression was not as good as I hoped. I know it´s a beta, but coming from valve i expected more.
Tons of animations missings (items, heroes, store), the UI is huge, camera too freaking close, oh well. Back to hon for now. But of course ppl will play it anyway cause it´s valve and has the dota "trademark". |
I played 13 hours of dota2 already, it is a really stiff and slow game compared to HoN, I dont like it either.
Every action input has a serious delay compared to HoN, its like I am playing in slowmotion. Dota1 is an old game, capped at 60fps and with some kind of builtin delay for every action input.
Dota2 has this too wtf... The fps cap can be removed with the console command fps_max 999, but the builtin delay is still there.
Icefrog says he is aware of the problem and will fix it asap, this was a month ago, so... What is the holdup.
The delay (note, I am not talking about delay in terms of server/connection) really makes it unplayable, I feel like a big noob again lol, the heroes react just too slow, I am used to make use of my pro reflexes (you heard that right  ), but that is a no-go in dota2 currently.
Waiting for Icefrogs promised fix before I take another dive into dota2.`edit: ok that's a lie, I am playing dota2 right now lol. But am still playing HoN too, will drop HoN if Icefrog fixes this.
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xExtreme
Posts: 5810
Location: 43 6C 75 6A 2D 4E 61 70 6F 63 61
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| Posted: Sat, 26th Nov 2011 21:01 Post subject: |
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sausje
Banned
Posts: 17716
Location: Limboland, Netherlands
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| Posted: Mon, 28th Nov 2011 12:27 Post subject: |
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| Posted: Mon, 28th Nov 2011 12:44 Post subject: |
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| Posted: Mon, 28th Nov 2011 12:44 Post subject: |
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Fucking editors I think in this case
The guy that wrote it probably has nothing to do with the images that accompany his article.
TWIN PEAKS is "something of a miracle."
"...like nothing else on television."
"a phenomenon."
"A tangled tale of sex, violence, power, junk food..."
"Like Nothing On Earth"
~ WHAT THEY'RE TRYING TO SAY CAN ONLY BE SEEN ~
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CHTUOgYNRzY
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| Posted: Mon, 28th Nov 2011 13:04 Post subject: |
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Pey and de_Turk : Don't mistake casting time with input lag. This input lag is close to being nonexistent, and has been fixed numerous times. It is hugely lower than in Warcraft 3, and should be unnoticeable ( it's about 20-30ms.. lol ).
People whined about it for months, and now they hardly do.. So I guess it's fixed ( never bothered me since I was so used to W3 ). Dodging spells or juking isn't hard at all.
HoN probably feels faster, but this isn't HoN, thankfully. HoN has got a faster pace than Dota: Dota 2 isn't meant to be different from its original, or to incorporate gameplay elements from its clones.
This is a 1:1 copy of DotA "1". It's not a matter of being not polished if the camera is "too close" . That's just how it is in DotA, and it will remain that way.
Some animations may be missing ( and even so, how many of them ? Hardly any ), some textures might be missing but gameplay-wise, this beta is very polished. Hardly any bugs. The reconnection features work flawlessly. I don't see what your fuss is about.
All in all most of the complaints I see are just relative to people not fully knowing DotA and wanting it to ressemble X clone they played beforehand.
And btw, it's a 50% complete beta that was rushed into a large beta by the ammount of QQ and complaints there was.. If it's not as polished as you wanted it to be, maybe patience should have been not one underrated virtue.
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| Posted: Mon, 28th Nov 2011 20:51 Post subject: |
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| TheZor wrote: | Pey and de_Turk : Don't mistake casting time with input lag. This input lag is close to being nonexistent, and has been fixed numerous times. It is hugely lower than in Warcraft 3, and should be unnoticeable ( it's about 20-30ms.. lol ).
People whined about it for months, and now they hardly do.. So I guess it's fixed ( never bothered me since I was so used to W3 ). Dodging spells or juking isn't hard at all.
HoN probably feels faster, but this isn't HoN, thankfully. HoN has got a faster pace than Dota: Dota 2 isn't meant to be different from its original, or to incorporate gameplay elements from its clones.
This is a 1:1 copy of DotA "1". It's not a matter of being not polished if the camera is "too close" . That's just how it is in DotA, and it will remain that way.
Some animations may be missing ( and even so, how many of them ? Hardly any ), some textures might be missing but gameplay-wise, this beta is very polished. Hardly any bugs. The reconnection features work flawlessly. I don't see what your fuss is about.
All in all most of the complaints I see are just relative to people not fully knowing DotA and wanting it to ressemble X clone they played beforehand.
And btw, it's a 50% complete beta that was rushed into a large beta by the ammount of QQ and complaints there was.. If it's not as polished as you wanted it to be, maybe patience should have been not one underrated virtue. |
this.
i love the beta so far (don't have time to play much :_( )
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Teramos
Posts: 336
Location: Outer Limits
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| Posted: Mon, 28th Nov 2011 21:19 Post subject: |
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| TheZor wrote: | Pey and de_Turk : Don't mistake casting time with input lag. This input lag is close to being nonexistent, and has been fixed numerous times. It is hugely lower than in Warcraft 3, and should be unnoticeable ( it's about 20-30ms.. lol ).
People whined about it for months, and now they hardly do.. So I guess it's fixed ( never bothered me since I was so used to W3 ). Dodging spells or juking isn't hard at all.
HoN probably feels faster, but this isn't HoN, thankfully. HoN has got a faster pace than Dota: Dota 2 isn't meant to be different from its original, or to incorporate gameplay elements from its clones.
This is a 1:1 copy of DotA "1". It's not a matter of being not polished if the camera is "too close" . That's just how it is in DotA, and it will remain that way.
Some animations may be missing ( and even so, how many of them ? Hardly any ), some textures might be missing but gameplay-wise, this beta is very polished. Hardly any bugs. The reconnection features work flawlessly. I don't see what your fuss is about.
All in all most of the complaints I see are just relative to people not fully knowing DotA and wanting it to ressemble X clone they played beforehand.
And btw, it's a 50% complete beta that was rushed into a large beta by the ammount of QQ and complaints there was.. If it's not as polished as you wanted it to be, maybe patience should have been not one underrated virtue. |
I am well aware of this. I am not talking about casting or attack animation, but the builtin delay. Lina and Leshrac aren;t godlike like in HoN due to the slow casting animation and attack animation, which is a good thing, but it has nothing to do with the builtin delay.
There is a delay in every command, move command, cast command, I can't even spam selfcast anymore, I literally have to stop using movecommands with my mouse, selfcast a potion and then spam move commands again. In HoN I can selfcast without stopping the movecommand spam. I hope this made sense.
Icefrog is already aware of this problem and will fix it soon, so I am not making this up.
Last edited by De_TURK on Mon, 28th Nov 2011 21:45; edited 1 time in total
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| Posted: Mon, 28th Nov 2011 21:21 Post subject: |
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ok... there is this guy I really don`t like... where do you come from?
srsly - no invites left - sorry ;(
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| Posted: Mon, 28th Nov 2011 21:27 Post subject: |
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| Teramos wrote: | i would kill literally for an invite!  |
Photo of you standing over a dead body with newspaper in hand, in here, tomorrow.
| sabin1981 wrote: | | Fuck you troll. Fuck you and your entire aids-infested family. Get cancer and die. Slowly. |
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| Posted: Tue, 29th Nov 2011 18:56 Post subject: |
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| De_TURK wrote: | | TheZor wrote: | Pey and de_Turk : Don't mistake casting time with input lag. This input lag is close to being nonexistent, and has been fixed numerous times. It is hugely lower than in Warcraft 3, and should be unnoticeable ( it's about 20-30ms.. lol ).
People whined about it for months, and now they hardly do.. So I guess it's fixed ( never bothered me since I was so used to W3 ). Dodging spells or juking isn't hard at all.
HoN probably feels faster, but this isn't HoN, thankfully. HoN has got a faster pace than Dota: Dota 2 isn't meant to be different from its original, or to incorporate gameplay elements from its clones.
This is a 1:1 copy of DotA "1". It's not a matter of being not polished if the camera is "too close" . That's just how it is in DotA, and it will remain that way.
Some animations may be missing ( and even so, how many of them ? Hardly any ), some textures might be missing but gameplay-wise, this beta is very polished. Hardly any bugs. The reconnection features work flawlessly. I don't see what your fuss is about.
All in all most of the complaints I see are just relative to people not fully knowing DotA and wanting it to ressemble X clone they played beforehand.
And btw, it's a 50% complete beta that was rushed into a large beta by the ammount of QQ and complaints there was.. If it's not as polished as you wanted it to be, maybe patience should have been not one underrated virtue. |
I am well aware of this. I am not talking about casting or attack animation, but the builtin delay. Lina and Leshrac aren;t godlike like in HoN due to the slow casting animation and attack animation, which is a good thing, but it has nothing to do with the builtin delay.
There is a delay in every command, move command, cast command, I can't even spam selfcast anymore, I literally have to stop using movecommands with my mouse, selfcast a potion and then spam move commands again. In HoN I can selfcast without stopping the movecommand spam. I hope this made sense.
Icefrog is already aware of this problem and will fix it soon, so I am not making this up. |
That was a directed a little more towards Pey
Yep there is a little inbuilt delay that should disappear once they completely finetune their netcode ( it has already been vastly reduced ).
But the example you gave would happen even if there wasn't any delay, it's a feature basically - here's the tip on how to do it in DotA or Dota 2: if you want to use any item or command without loosing focus or waste any second, you can queue commands.
For instance, move, shift+use item, move, and you will move without any interruption while using the item inbetween those two move orders  Works for any command.
This won't change afaik, and won't be like HoN: it's a matter of knowing how to use this little trick or not. Those who can queue actions won't loose any time, those who don't will.
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| Posted: Tue, 29th Nov 2011 19:13 Post subject: |
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| TheZor wrote: | | De_TURK wrote: | | TheZor wrote: | Pey and de_Turk : Don't mistake casting time with input lag. This input lag is close to being nonexistent, and has been fixed numerous times. It is hugely lower than in Warcraft 3, and should be unnoticeable ( it's about 20-30ms.. lol ).
People whined about it for months, and now they hardly do.. So I guess it's fixed ( never bothered me since I was so used to W3 ). Dodging spells or juking isn't hard at all.
HoN probably feels faster, but this isn't HoN, thankfully. HoN has got a faster pace than Dota: Dota 2 isn't meant to be different from its original, or to incorporate gameplay elements from its clones.
This is a 1:1 copy of DotA "1". It's not a matter of being not polished if the camera is "too close" . That's just how it is in DotA, and it will remain that way.
Some animations may be missing ( and even so, how many of them ? Hardly any ), some textures might be missing but gameplay-wise, this beta is very polished. Hardly any bugs. The reconnection features work flawlessly. I don't see what your fuss is about.
All in all most of the complaints I see are just relative to people not fully knowing DotA and wanting it to ressemble X clone they played beforehand.
And btw, it's a 50% complete beta that was rushed into a large beta by the ammount of QQ and complaints there was.. If it's not as polished as you wanted it to be, maybe patience should have been not one underrated virtue. |
I am well aware of this. I am not talking about casting or attack animation, but the builtin delay. Lina and Leshrac aren;t godlike like in HoN due to the slow casting animation and attack animation, which is a good thing, but it has nothing to do with the builtin delay.
There is a delay in every command, move command, cast command, I can't even spam selfcast anymore, I literally have to stop using movecommands with my mouse, selfcast a potion and then spam move commands again. In HoN I can selfcast without stopping the movecommand spam. I hope this made sense.
Icefrog is already aware of this problem and will fix it soon, so I am not making this up. |
That was a directed a little more towards Pey
Yep there is a little inbuilt delay that should disappear once they completely finetune their netcode ( it has already been vastly reduced ).
But the example you gave would happen even if there wasn't any delay, it's a feature basically - here's the tip on how to do it in DotA or Dota 2: if you want to use any item or command without loosing focus or waste any second, you can queue commands.
For instance, move, shift+use item, move, and you will move without any interruption while using the item inbetween those two move orders Works for any command.
This won't change afaik, and won't be like HoN: it's a matter of knowing how to use this little trick or not. Those who can queue actions won't loose any time, those who don't will. |
They should fix this as well lol. How can there be a delay in selecting an item and then clicking on urself, seems to me like bad coding. To clarify this is what I do, doubletap fast on itemkey (selfcast) and THEN spam some movecommands. Now I have to wait like half a second before I can spam or else the game doesn't register the selfcast, OR use shift queue.
I was really confused at start, yknow, when someone is chasing me early game and I need to use the health potion, waiting half a second before using movecommand is too much. Shift queue will take a while to get used to but simply selecting and targeting stuff shouldnt have any delay.
Other than this I can see this game is awesome, voiceacting, models, colours, spectating. The menu interface need a lot of work tho.
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| Posted: Tue, 29th Nov 2011 20:47 Post subject: |
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| De_TURK wrote: | I was really confused at start, yknow, when someone is chasing me early game and I need to use the health potion, waiting half a second before using movecommand is too much. Shift queue will take a while to get used to but simply selecting and targeting stuff shouldnt have any delay.
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"half a second"? Massive exaggeration won't help your case, you know.
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Pey
Posts: 5601
Location: Argentina
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| Posted: Tue, 29th Nov 2011 21:20 Post subject: |
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I´m not complaining about input lag, I had no problem whatever lasthiting and I play with 200-250ms. However, I can´t get used to the game´s mechanic, the controls feel a bit closer to LOL than W3´s DOTA or HON. It feels... hmmm.... gummy? lol
Seasonic 1000w Planitum - TT Level 10 GT - ASUS M5E - i7 2600k @ 5.0ghz - 16GB Patriot Viper 3 - Dell u3011 - EVGA GTX 980 @ SLI - SSD Samsung EVO 250GB - 16TB W.D. - G19/G13 @ Roccat Kone XTD - Razer Vespula - Xonar Phoebus @ Vulcan ANC/Corsair 2100 Vengeance - Logitech G51
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| Posted: Tue, 29th Nov 2011 22:07 Post subject: |
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| dezztroy wrote: | | De_TURK wrote: | I was really confused at start, yknow, when someone is chasing me early game and I need to use the health potion, waiting half a second before using movecommand is too much. Shift queue will take a while to get used to but simply selecting and targeting stuff shouldnt have any delay.
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"half a second"? Massive exaggeration won't help your case, you know. |
100ms then? Whatever it is, it should be instant. I am not saying the potion should start healing instantly, am saying that the game should know what I am telling it to do. So if I doubletap the potion and then rightclick somewhere on the ground, it should do those commands in succesion, not simply ignore the doubletap.
It would be perfectly understandable if it was a spell, but since when do potions have casting time.
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