During my search for a nice upgrade, I decided to just do an almost full build (I'm going to use my GTX1080). So it all became more expensive than I like. I'd like some tips on this build, since I've been out of "da game" for some time now.
This makes 813 euros. Mobo will be a used Asrock x470 Taichi. The Noctua fans will be used as intake fans, expensive shit but they are supposed to be great.
Any weird things you guys can see?
Looks good. I will tell You my opinion on each component as I've recently upgraded to 3700x and have some experience to share... here is my build and below comments on your choices.
Fractal Define C, MSI Rtx 2070, 3700x(still stock cooler), Gigabyte x570 aorus elite, 2x8gb hyperx predator 3200mhz cl16, only nvme drives (corsair mp510 480gb but I am buying 1tb soon) and 550w evga g2 psu.
- AMD Ryzen 7 3700X €345 - That's what I've got. Single core over 2x as fast as old 2500k. Multicore 3 to 4 times faster. Ready for the future but also quite problematic right now. Voltages are going crazy all around, temps are going crazy, zen2 builds take 30 seconds to post (before windows loading) and it's not motherboard dependent for the most part. It's either this or 9900k and 9900k seems more mature, stable and just "finished product" while AMD will need many, many bios updates and chipset driver updates...
Also - There is barely any oc headroom. The 3700x does not reach 4.4ghz out of the box. It;'s 4.3 single core and 4.1 all cores speeds.... and hot hot hot
- Fractal Design Meshify C €85 - Great case. I prefer something with more filters and silent. I have Define C just because I like the simple look and padded side panels. it really silents the pc quite a bit. But meshify is great too!
- Scythe Fuma 2 €51 - Looks good. I plan to get thermalright macho myself since I've had one before and it was great.
- 2x Noctua NF-A14 PWM €43 - fractal fans are very good. My define C included 2 fans and these are unaudible up to 900rpm and that's all You need for a case. I've mounted these as intake and bought corsair sp120 for back outtake, soif meshify comes with 2 fans, You can maybe use em as intakes and get noctua for back?
- Crucial BLS2K8G4D32AESCK €86 - seems fine. 3200mhz is good for ryzen. 3600 is supposedly better but not much for how much more expensive it is. Just check if XMP profiles work on motherboard You want to get.
- Seasonic Focus Plus Gold 650 €93 - johny guru recommends it. Looks good! I've got evga g2 based on his recommendations and perfect. Modular and silent.
- Crucial MX500 1TB €110 - I've did some research recently into this topic - Ssd prices are super weird right now. Samsung is still expensive but all other brands have nvme prices matching sata prices. Corsair mp510 for example. I've returned crucial mx500 1tb because I've noticed that nvme corsair is only 20usd more expensive! Although if I wanted to go for Sata ssd (or sata m.2) crucial mx500 is supposedly amazing. That'y why I've got it.. and never unpacked.. and returned...
The most important zen2 choice is unfortunately motherboard. I've got msi b450 tomahawk first but as for everyone - it failed to boot regularly. People still have this problems and MSI just stated that they will never fully fix it and these boards will keep using LITE shit bios and people should buy their MAX motherboards... I just returned it and went for x570. Since I did not wanted to give MSI my money, I went for gigabyte and it's good. Adjustable fan curves and everything works great. 2x pcie 4.0 ports, ability to use 2 m.2 drives without any drawbacks. At this price range it was either MSI or Gigabyte elite since only those boards have chipset fan below the gpu... what is weird is that more expensive motherboards have gpu obstructing chipset fan. But as I've noticed with aorus elite I have - the fan almost always idles and don't spin.
I am not saying b450/x470 will not work - just do Your research and DO NOT GET MSI. x470 taichi should be ok
edit: PICS!
Spoiler:
3080 | ps5 pro
Sin317-"im 31 years old and still surprised at how much shit comes out of my ass actually ..."
SteamDRM-"Call of Duty is the symbol of the true perfection in every aspect. Call of Duty games are like Mozart's/Beethoven's symphonies"
deadpoetic-"are you new to the cyberspace?"
The 9900k costs quite a lot more here and it runs terribly hot according to reviews. Draws quite some power too. Have you seen the reddit thread about the high idle voltages for the 3700x? Apparently anything but CPU-z triggers the CPU to boost, so voltage is high when using monitoring tools.
Cases don't matter much to me, I just chose the best case for airflow. I was considering the NZXT H500 and Define C, but the Meshify seems to be the best in airflow. I did not think about noise though, you have a point How is the airflow in your Define C?
I don't know what to do about airflow, so I just searched two of the best fans for intakes. You have to have better intake than exhaust the experts say, but I don't know how much that helps (worth the extra money?). Would those two 120mm case fans, one in one out, suffice? For reference, my current shitty case has zero airflow.
I don't absolutely need a big SSD now, but I wanted to replace my 1TB HDD. I didn't see any reports about price changes or new releases. 860 1TB is about 50% more expensive, IMO not worth the few percentage performance gain. There's also Intel 660p, but it apparently leans heavily on cache and when that's full it loses speed drastically. I didn't read enough about it to know when that kicks in during normal usage though.
The motherboard I bought from a friend of a friend who absolutely needed x570 for some reason. He was running a 3700x stable for a few days.
Last edited by Mister_s on Fri, 26th Jul 2019 10:45; edited 1 time in total
I am using ryzen master to check temps and voltages. Also using windows balanced power plan as described in that reddit post. Generally it's okish now but the speeds and vcore is very jumpy. That don't seem to cause any trouble though.
Defince C airflow is fine. The air comes in through the side front vents. I can feel the airflow near those vents... and I can clearly see a lot of dust accumulated on the intake filter. I need to clean it once a month. I was running 1 in, 1 out for 2 years and it's fine but I've decided to move that back one to front and replace it with corsair on the back which I've been using with cpu cooler on previous build... since why not? I only did that now and I will observe the case pressure in the coming omnths. Hopefully 2 intakes, 2 outtake will create positive pressure and less dust build up.
You don't need nvme at all but if the price is competitive, why not. Crucial mx500 have very good reviews and intel is as you've said - weird about that cache stuff.
3080 | ps5 pro
Sin317-"im 31 years old and still surprised at how much shit comes out of my ass actually ..."
SteamDRM-"Call of Duty is the symbol of the true perfection in every aspect. Call of Duty games are like Mozart's/Beethoven's symphonies"
deadpoetic-"are you new to the cyberspace?"
I'll be going for the 1TB Intel 660p instead of the MX500. According to reviews you won't hit that cache cock-block in normal usage, it's also 10 euros cheaper than the MX500. I really like the idea of not using any cables
I'll be thinking about the case. I really like the NZXT H500 but airflow (intake) seems to be bad :/
Wouldn't a case being loud or not have a direct relation with the fans? Saying case x is louder than case y would only make sense if fans were running at 100%. I'm planning on running the fans as low as possible. I watched a gamersnexus vid a while back where they put up a high-end sound insulated Bequite case against a cheaper airflow oriented case (meshed). At a fixed noise volume the meshed case performed better when looking at temps.
Good Bequite fans are very expensive so I went for Noctua. There's also the cheaper Corsair ML140 fans, but apperently those are louder.
Fractal Design R6 is too big, I don't need all that space. How would the FD Define C or the Bequiet Pure Base 600 be? Does the case really get enough air from the two long slits on the front?
Just get 9700k if its for gaming. Outdoes 9900k and the price is absolutely agreeable for such a fine cpu.
The 9700k has been made obsolete IMO. The 3700x trashes it in multicore performace and difference in gaming is 2-4% in the 9700K's favor. Even that might change when the new consoles with their 8-core CPUs get released. For pure gaming, the 3600 is the clear winner, there's no competition at all. But since I want this CPU to last as much as my 3570 did, I'm going a step up to the 3700x.
As Leo is usually saying; it depends on the user case.
There are basically two main differences between the 3700x and the 9700k:
1. Ryzen 3700x is an 8-core / 16-thread CPU whereas the 9700k is an 8-core CPU.
2. Ryzen 3700x isn't really meant for overclocking maxing out @ 4.2-4.3GHz on all cores. Meanwhile the 9700k can usually reach 5-5.1GHz. That makes a ton of difference in single threaded and medium multi-threaded performance.
From what I've seen the 3700x is the best choice if you are after proper multi threaded workloads such as content creation and so on. At the same time the 9700k takes the cake when it comes to gaming and where a higher IPC is prioritized over many threads.
There are obviously many other differences beyond those two but I find those two to be most interesting from the perspective of someone looking to build a new system.
As for myself, I'd go with the 9700k simply because I already have a compatible Z370 motherboard with RAM.
I am happy that AMD is finally competing not only when it comes to price but actually performance as well. The whole CPU market has been stagnant ever since AMD lost their performance competitiveness a decade ago. I hope this new situation will lead to further innovation and larger gains per generation. The original Zen-architecture was a great leap forward for AMD and the CPU market. Zen 2 took it to the next level and then some, catching up to Intel.
This is what we've all been hoping for for years. It's become competitive again.
(if they could only do the same on the GPU side I'd be a happy camper)
I disagree with you there. The 9700K does perform better in games, but that edge diminishes when you go to 1440 or 4K (unless you'll always want that 144Hz I guess). There are some games which really benefit from higher IPC it seems, like Witcher 3 and BF5, but those are outliers. Since 4K is the future, for me at least, the difference between these two CPUs should be smaller and smaller.
You can obviously OC the 9700K, but you'll need a very good cooler for that. I'm going to use the boxed cooler for the AMD 3700x for now to see how it is, but according to reviews it's very good. I'll only get that 1KG monster if I really need to (so -€50 for AMD). Power consumption will also drastically increase, which is already higher for the 9700k compared to 3700x. Not everyone cares about that obviously. Don't you need a Z390 to get those crazy OC with 9700k?
I also have to take the future into account, mainly the upcoming consoles. Since Sony and MS will both use a 8c/16t Zen2 CPU, devs might do something with all those threads and architecture specific things. This is pure speculation of course, but this build has the last me at least five years.
This was my process during the decision between these two CPUs. Purely based on reviews and future expectations obviously. IMO if you only game and are planning to upgrade again in 2-3 years, the 3600 is the absolute best choice. If you plan on keeping it for many years, might as well get the 3700x over the 9700k. It's also a matter of luck in my case. I got a cheap (130 euros) Asrock x470 Taichi, I might've gone for a 9700k if a cheap Z370 came my way.
I gather you've seen this review (they don't test 4K, only up to 1440p which is the current feasible choice for high end GPU's)?
It kind of reinforce my statement about the 9700K being better suited for gaming while the 3700X is better suited for productivity tasks if we're talking about a straight comparison.
As for the differences between Z370 and Z390 we're mainly talking about some added features that aren't affecting overclocking. How high you can O/C is basically dependent on which model(s) of a particular brand you buy (amount and quality of power phases, board layout and components in general etc.). From what I've read my board (ASUS ROG STRIX Z370 Gaming-H) should be able to push a 9700K to ~5+GHz without any issues taking silicon lottery into consideration. I do have a Corsair H100i AIO cooler so I don't have a massive heat sink on top of the CPU hanging off the board.
I did not see that review since I don't like video reviews. I didn't know he even reviewed it since he usually always posts a written review on the site. Those are some very strong margins for the 9700K compared to other reviews though. He also benches half of the games on 1080p and medium settings.
This is all a meaningless duscussion IMO, since both CPUs are very close in gaming if you're not trying to put the strain mostly on CPU (1080p, low/medium). Both of these CPUs coupled to something like a 2070 and on 1440p or 4K gives the 9700K a slight edge. I am talking about 3700x with boost and 9700K with boost to 4.9Ghz btw. You get slightly less performance in games for less power usage and less heat with 3700x. That matters to me personally and I goit a cheap mobo as I said.
In the end, it's all a personal and financial choice Like the fucking case which I can't decide on
PS. I don't know the difference between Z370 and Z390. I read somewhere the 9700K required a Z390 (better VRM?) for good OC. Must've been BS.
The difference in performance only shows if you make it show through benchmarking. In 99.9% of the cases where the CPU difference shows, the framerate is high enough for it to not matter.
"Enlightenment is man's emergence from his self-imposed nonage. Nonage is the inability to use one's own understanding without another's guidance. This nonage is self-imposed if its cause lies not in lack of understanding but in indecision and lack of courage to use one's own mind without another's guidance. Dare to know! (Sapere aude.) "Have the courage to use your own understanding," is therefore the motto of the enlightenment."
Yeah I saw that vid. I like Linus, but that vid was a lot of bitching for a final one minute of "buuut the normal user will never see the scenarios I've shown soooo the drive is good for 99% of people out there"
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How is the airflow in your Define C?
