Securom 7 is dead
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CableMunkeh




Posts: 198

PostPosted: Fri, 13th Jan 2006 11:24    Post subject:
Turkmenski wrote:
I think we could see a totally another approach with PC games with hardware components similar to mod chips in console market.
The problem at the moment is probably there is no market, but there could be.
I believe that cracking XBOX 360 is way harder as removing any SF protecetion, but there is a lot of money to be made so more capable people are working on it. And it is a much better solution as cracking each game.

I think mod chip for PC would sell as hell if it would be capable of running all so far released games directly from CD/DVD and of course allow future updates. What do you think?


I think that's a load of, erm, excrement to be honest Smile

Console copy protection is mostly in hardware, so the solution is in hardware. PC copy protection with the exception of dongles isn't.

Research for the win dude.
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Turkmenski




Posts: 35

PostPosted: Sat, 14th Jan 2006 15:12    Post subject:
So you are saying an IDE controller doesn't fool most of the latest protections?

Don't you think with specific drivers it could be almost perfect. Or that IDE commands could be manipulated so that burned CDs/DVDs could be recognized as real.
Or that CD/DVD-ROM firmware could be modified so that it would lie about whether a copy or original is inserted.

Think out of the box.
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CableMunkeh




Posts: 198

PostPosted: Sat, 14th Jan 2006 16:03    Post subject:
Turkmenski wrote:
So you are saying an IDE controller doesn't fool most of the latest protections?

Don't you think with specific drivers it could be almost perfect. Or that IDE commands could be manipulated so that burned CDs/DVDs could be recognized as real.
Or that CD/DVD-ROM firmware could be modified so that it would lie about whether a copy or original is inserted.

Think out of the box.


Then you get a non-standard PC which can in one step be permanently shitlisted by all protections, as it's no longer an x86 / IBM compatible PC. Not to mention that this hardware would require extensive driver support, again shitlist-able.

Then there's the issues this would cause with legitimate applications that might want to use the services this hardware is hooking.

The CD/DVD-ROMs only have 1 basic check they can do on a disc to see if it's on a CDR/DVDR or an original printed disc. That's all that a dodgy firmware would do for you. It wouldn't be able to replace software emulation, it wouldn't be able to read angles, etc, from a disc that Starforce requests, it wouldn't be able to arbitrarily place the 'twin peaks' at the front of every SD disc.

The IDE controller in the nforce boards doesn't fool anything. It is just not addressable by the normal ways that Starforce uses on other boards to re-activiate the IDE channels/nodes. All you can do with the IDE controller is disable bits to force some protections to run images. Nothing that (again) isn't easily shitlist-able.

With the appropriate drivers it would be perfect? Again shitlist the appropriate drivers and that's that put to bed as well.

PCs have to adhere to a hardware standard, mess with that it's not a PC anymore. Trying to do masses of emulation, etc, with software is already done, then reversed by the protection managers and nulified / shitlisted.

Again research for the win. If it were that easy people would have already done it (various CD/DVD drive firmware hacks, driver, etc, hacks). Hardware might help with very limited help to running clones, but as a longer term solution the only viable way to beat the software protection is to not bother unless you've far more free time than is possibly reasonable Very Happy
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CableMunkeh




Posts: 198

PostPosted: Mon, 23rd Jan 2006 02:06    Post subject:
TheDuck wrote:
You are wrong, tables from the crack are nowhere near the tables from memory since engines from the exe and sd dll are not same. So they calculated tables for the original engine. And it's not hard to write very same engine to b&w2 exe, it's like 3 functions and voila Crying or Very sad That's what I meant about being lazy... since groups still haven't done that.


B+W2 is a deeper and more complex switching table/matrix than Civ. It's not the same maths at all Sad
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tainted4ever
VIP Member



Posts: 11336

PostPosted: Mon, 23rd Jan 2006 04:53    Post subject:
They just change the math from version to version, preveting the creation of a generic emulator. You make an emu, it will work for a handful of games, then they update. Ofc. once you make an emu, you know all the tricks so it should be easy to make another, but IMO its tiring.


Sense Amid Madness, Wit Amidst Folly
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CableMunkeh




Posts: 198

PostPosted: Mon, 23rd Jan 2006 18:13    Post subject:
tainted4ever wrote:
They just change the math from version to version, preveting the creation of a generic emulator. You make an emu, it will work for a handful of games, then they update. Ofc. once you make an emu, you know all the tricks so it should be easy to make another, but IMO its tiring.


Not just the math but the settings in each game, these are the parameters that SDAPI uses and are controllable by developers.
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