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 Posted: Wed, 20th Dec 2023 14:57 Post subject: |
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| Nodrim wrote: | | I played a few hours in chapter 4 and I like it. The chapter is very well written so far and the situation I'm put in is very interesting. |
Question re: chapter 4 quest progression: can you not advance the  Spoiler: | Lord Inquisitor questline unless you have done the Hunting Grounds quest |
?
| Frant wrote: | | Shitass games are ruining piracy. |
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dsergei
Posts: 4044
Location: Moscow, Russia
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Nodrim
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| Posted: Wed, 20th Dec 2023 17:32 Post subject: |
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| r3dshift wrote: | | Nodrim wrote: | | I played a few hours in chapter 4 and I like it. The chapter is very well written so far and the situation I'm put in is very interesting. |
Question re: chapter 4 quest progression: can you not advance the | Spoiler: | Lord Inquisitor questline unless you have done the Hunting Grounds quest |
? |
I meant to say chapter 3 which I enjoyed a lot so far.
| dsergei wrote: | So Idira, Jae and Abelard are just missing from Chapter 3  |
Are you supposed to find them if they were not part of your party at the end of chapter 2? My Reunion quest only mentions the companions that were with me at the time.
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dsergei
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Location: Moscow, Russia
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| Posted: Wed, 20th Dec 2023 22:50 Post subject: |
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@Nodrim
They were in my party. I think it's a bug - I got Pascal and Cassia instead. I thought it was implied that all of you got taken.
I also liked Chapter 3 although there were way too many battles in the end.
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Nodrim
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Location: Romania
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| Posted: Wed, 20th Dec 2023 23:11 Post subject: |
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I got the bug with two Ulfar.
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| Posted: Wed, 20th Dec 2023 23:26 Post subject: |
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It's already hotfixed but the yarr availability is behind.
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Nodrim
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dsergei
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| Posted: Thu, 21st Dec 2023 06:37 Post subject: |
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@Immunity
Have you tried saving and reloading several times? I got stuck like that in several zones (no exit zone) including my chambers on the ship. Several reloads fixed it every time.
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| Posted: Thu, 21st Dec 2023 06:45 Post subject: |
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| dsergei wrote: | @Immunity
Have you tried saving and reloading several times? I got stuck like that in several zones (no exit zone) including my chambers on the ship. Several reloads fixed it every time. |
Tried reloading a quick-save several times, no dice. Also tried doing the entire fight again, same result. Even patched up from 1.0.68 to 1.0.73 (latest as far as I know), and it made no difference.
I suppose I could always try for the other two options available in the dialogue, but I don't want that seeing as I'm on a Heretical playthrough - this is my chance to, as they say, kill two birds with one stone, and I'll be damned if I'm going to pass that up.
I can never be free, because the shackles I wear can't be touched or be seen.
i9-9900k, MSI MPG-Z390 Gaming Pro Carbon, 32GB DDR4 @ 3000, eVGA GTX 1080 DT, Samsung 970 EVO Plus nVME 1TB
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| Posted: Thu, 21st Dec 2023 17:01 Post subject: |
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Just got to chapter 3 and man... talk about making a character completely irredeemable. I can't see a single in character reason to keep them around after that. This was written and generally handled very poorly honestly.
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Nodrim
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| Posted: Thu, 21st Dec 2023 17:40 Post subject: |
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I can't justify keeping her around. Not only for what she did, which is more then enough, but for how stupid she is for trusting the drukhari.
Honestly I think this experience warrants a conversion from iconoclast to full dogmatic, cause when it happened I went full on fuck the xenos scum.
| Spoiler: | And the dumbest thing is that they already had a traitor set up in case you don't take her in the first place. So they could have just changed the story slightly and made it work anyway when you treat her well. Cause then what is the point in even having options as to how you act toward people if you can't earn their loyalty?
And I get you kept her, but like I don't even think you should have the option to keep her. Why, outside her being a strong character so you want to use her OOC, would the Rogue trader ever trust her ever again? And why would any one of the companions still respect and follow you if you do? Already you took a Xenos in and made them tolerate her, but now they all suffered for it and potentially everyone else. The Rogue Trader is responsable for far too much for it to ever be worth the risk. Even more so when it isn't like you were all that tight to begin with. She wasn't a great friend or anything were you can kind of accept it.
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Nodrim
Posts: 9414
Location: Romania
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| Posted: Thu, 21st Dec 2023 18:10 Post subject: |
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Idira and Argenta are in somewhat similar situations. But this could have been handled so much better.
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| Posted: Thu, 21st Dec 2023 18:23 Post subject: |
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I'm not even sure I know what you're talking about and I don't want it spoiled either, but even if they do something similar later on, they were part of the crew way before you even showed up so it doesn't even fall on you as much, like in this case. I know Idira did the whole early summoning, but that is handled way better and also is not even in the same universe of betrayal. At the very least it doesn't feel like it.
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| Posted: Thu, 21st Dec 2023 19:46 Post subject: |
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Like I wrote earlier, the writing in this game took a nosedive starting from Chapter 3. Chapter 4 is similarly piss poor, but at least it's also riddled with myriads of bugs.
| Frant wrote: | | Shitass games are ruining piracy. |
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| Posted: Thu, 21st Dec 2023 20:30 Post subject: |
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Regarding Yrliet and act 3:
| Spoiler: |
I think she's consistent in hating humans, longs after her people and is ready to do anything for them. Everybody warns the rogue trader about her, it's up to the RT alone whether to go against the team and recruit her. She is on a ship where pretty much everybody hates her and she hates everybody. Maybe she's beginning to see a few passable qualities in the protagonist depending on your choices, but she barely knows the trader by the point she sees the rock and then she flies off the handle completely, thinking all her doubts and fears were proven true right then and there. I don't find it the least bit odd she betrayed the RT and I also don't lament that the RT can't "fix" her. In fact, I hope that if the RT forgives her and brings her along, she will unavoidably betray them AGAIN. That would be a nice change to the typical RPG tropes. At that point, some people of the retinue might call it quits, too, having lost their faith in the RT's leadership. I would have expected it to already happen if the RT decides to keep her in act 3. |
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Nodrim
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| Posted: Thu, 21st Dec 2023 20:44 Post subject: |
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Friendly relations between people of the Imperium and Eldari are not exactly something unheard of. Just look up Roboute Guilliman.
In the latest lore, both the Eldari and Humanity have become more aware of the fact that they fight the same enemies.
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| Posted: Thu, 21st Dec 2023 20:48 Post subject: |
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| Nodrim wrote: | Friendly relations between people of the Imperium and Eldari are not exactly something unheard of. Just look up Roboute Guilliman.
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Perhaps, but from what I gathered from the game's dialogue, relations aboard the ship were not friendly at all. Besides which:
| Spoiler: |
If you follow Yrliet's quest to find the Eldari wrecks, IIRC all of them were blown to bits by imperial ships. |
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| Posted: Thu, 21st Dec 2023 21:19 Post subject: |
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| Spoiler: | None of that matters. It isn't like the Eldari are innocent little flowers and they've never attacked humans or whatever. This is all just making excuses for excuse sake. It holds no water.
Fact is that my Rogue trader treated her well and with patience. He not only kept his word every time, including with keeping her people protected. She can see through interaction that I was not, unlike her a xenos hater.
Seeing the Rock doesn't mean shit, it wasn't yours and your character couldn't have had anything to do with whatever happened with her people anyway. You weren't even officially the rogue trader when you met her...
I could even excuse a lot of planning in the back, but if she thinks the drukhari know anything why would she not change her mind when you tell her you'd help go to the coordanates as soon as possible to help find her people, again going out of your way to help her, and tell you about the trap in exchange for your help in getting info out of them?
Why would she trust the fucking drukhari over someone that has time and time again proven to be trustworthy and understanding?
Oh, right ... it is because the plot needed to happen and chapter 3 is all about being captured for whatever reason. Not like there aren't tons of problems with the whole capturing thing anyway, like how it is just plot happens and you get captured cause reasons ... why don't they do this any other time? I mean they knew were you were for so long and could have just murdered you this way at any point. Just magic fart gas of complete incapacitation. |
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Nodrim
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| Posted: Thu, 21st Dec 2023 21:30 Post subject: |
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| Divvy wrote: | | Nodrim wrote: | Friendly relations between people of the Imperium and Eldari are not exactly something unheard of. Just look up Roboute Guilliman.
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Perhaps, but from what I gathered from the game's dialogue, relations aboard the ship were not friendly at all. Besides which:
| Spoiler: |
If you follow Yrliet's quest to find the Eldari wrecks, IIRC all of them were blown to bits by imperial ships. |
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I know, I read everything zealously. 
| Kezmark wrote: | | Spoiler: | None of that matters. It isn't like the Eldari are innocent little flowers and they've never attacked humans or whatever. This is all just making excuses for excuse sake. It holds no water.
Fact is that my Rogue trader treated her well and with patience. He not only kept his word every time, including with keeping her people protected. She can see through interaction that I was not, unlike her a xenos hater.
Seeing the Rock doesn't mean shit, it wasn't yours and your character couldn't have had anything to do with whatever happened with her people anyway. You weren't even officially the rogue trader when you met her...
I could even excuse a lot of planning in the back, but if she thinks the drukhari know anything why would she not change her mind when you tell her you'd help go to the coordanates as soon as possible to help find her people, again going out of your way to help her, and tell you about the trap in exchange for your help in getting info out of them?
Why would she trust the fucking drukhari over someone that has time and time again proven to be trustworthy and understanding?
Oh, right ... it is because the plot needed to happen and chapter 3 is all about being captured for whatever reason. Not like there aren't tons of problems with the whole capturing thing anyway, like how it is just plot happens and you get captured cause reasons ... why don't they do this any other time? I mean they knew were you were for so long and could have just murdered you this way at any point. Just magic fart gas of complete incapacitation. |
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You forget about the warp influence that's driving her to the edge.
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| Posted: Fri, 22nd Dec 2023 06:30 Post subject: |
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Yeah, I don't care about "warp influence". My main character is a psyker (which is rarely aknowledge and kind of all around a disappointment in terms of RP anyway), Idira is an unsanctioned psyker, the ship is protected, and neither of us just turn in to a different person. The whole warp bit with her is a throwaway line and if you're not versed in the lore you'd have no clue about Eldar and the warp anyway.
The whole betrayal happens after a long stay on the planet, she had a long time to think on it, it wasn't just a spur of the moment thing as a heated emotional choice. It was calculated and planned, and in retrospect it kind of kills the game for me since it commits a cardinal sin of RPGs, and that is breaking the illusion of choice.
I don't feel like there's much point interacting with your party anymore, least of all to do their quests. I just don't care, since none of what you do matters anyway, so you might as well just roll some dice to pick how you act with them.
Its sad when not interacting with an npc makes the game infinitely better.
Also the Reunion quest only mentions Yrliet, Pasqal and Abelard and then find the bodyguard ? Does that mean that Cassia and Heinrix are just bugged out of the chapter and I should reload from before?
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Nodrim
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Location: Romania
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| Posted: Fri, 22nd Dec 2023 08:35 Post subject: |
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Only that Idira does and it's not even a good comparison. Humans travel through warp all the time because they are a non-psychic race and are not actively hunted by a chaos god. Eldari rarely use it and only when it's absolutely necessary.
If I remember correctly, the betrayal happens at the beginning of the stay on the planet and it's not like the scars left by the warp disappear just like that.
The rest of the companions are mentioned later in the quest
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| Posted: Fri, 22nd Dec 2023 09:09 Post subject: |
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Humans also have the gellar field and navigators, both of which are present on the ship, so she would not be as affected as on an eldari vesel either way.
When she made the deal is irrelevant, as you were stuck on the planet for what is implied to be a long time, during which she had enough time to think on her options and get clear headed. I could even understand the whole bit more if the Eldar Seer was involved, but whatever... At the end of the day she thinks setting you and your crew up to a fate worse then death is acceptable for that 0.1% chance she ain't conned. So at that point, if she's that weak minded then it doesn't even matter since it should just happen again and again if you take her back.
I would have taken this whole bit better if you couldn't interract with her at all and she acted more like a mercenary, or if she joined as a spy from the start and everything was an act. This just seems like artificial drama some dev wanted to make up, especially since the trap happens even when you don't have her, but really it just kills of the character for me.
| Nodrim wrote: |
The rest of the companions are mentioned later in the quest |
Anyway, thanks for the info, read a lot about bugs and didn't want to push through if I was going to have to redo it all. Honestly might just wait a year or two for things to get fixed, especially since a lot of the hype was killed by this whole event.
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dsergei
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| Posted: Tue, 26th Dec 2023 11:25 Post subject: |
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I got bored of it and uninstalled :/
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| Posted: Tue, 26th Dec 2023 11:29 Post subject: |
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Still playing it, but barely pushing through. Chapter 3 really killed it for me, the shitty artificial difficulty, the garbage gameplay, writing drops off a cliff. The fact this is 40k is most of the reason why I didn't drop it, I loved the prologue, chapter 1 and most of chapter 2, but fuck ... it feels like they switched teams completely sometime in the second half of chapter 2.
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| Posted: Tue, 26th Dec 2023 11:34 Post subject: |
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| Kezmark wrote: | | Still playing it, but barely pushing through. Chapter 3 really killed it for me, the shitty artificial difficulty, the garbage gameplay, writing drops off a cliff. The fact this is 40k is most of the reason why I didn't drop it, I loved the prologue, chapter 1 and most of chapter 2, but fuck ... it feels like they switched teams completely sometime in the second half of chapter 2. |
^ this.
I have stopped playing in Chapter 4 for the time being, mainly because of all the annoying bugs, the absurd difficulty spike, and the drop in the quality of writing. Like you said, it's as if an entirely different team was working on the 2nd half of the game. Such a shame.
| Frant wrote: | | Shitass games are ruining piracy. |
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Nodrim
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Location: Romania
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| Posted: Tue, 26th Dec 2023 12:05 Post subject: |
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What's this drop in the quality of writing that you keep talking about without giving no examples?
Chapter 3 was great for getting you, a powerful leader, out of the comfort zone. If anything, the chapter was too short. From chapter 4 I finished some companion's quests (Heinrix and Abelard) and a few side areas and they were pretty great. Heinrix's quest I liked in particular as it gave more nuance to the character. The main plot also starts to take shape, hinting back to dialogues and actions from chapter 1&2 that didn't mean much at the time.
There are things that could have been written better? For sure, some moments didn't have the same delicious details or didn't click as well as they could. There are also a lot of limitations imposed by the license and GW (Owlcat have hinted this), but they bent the rules as much as they could while staying true to the universe.
Also, what difficulty spike in chapter 4? I'm afraid that with exemplar talents, the Rogue Trader's party can take on primarchs.
The bugs are plenty , I'll give you that, mostly minor but plenty. My rumours are a mess, some talents don't work because they are in conflict with other talents, skill checks don't always properly register and many more.
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| Posted: Tue, 26th Dec 2023 13:33 Post subject: |
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I keep hearing this you "powerful leader" getting out of your comfort zone.
You're a barely promoted rogue trader, who's spend the last few chapters losing at every turn, getting his planets ravaged and being played around with by a twat dark elf. At no point in the narrative until then do I feel like I was ever powerful or in control. The only people you can exert influence on or are "Oh powerful Rogue Trader" to aren't relvevant to the main plot or people of importance in general.
What drop in quality.... let's see, looney-tunes ass villain at the end of chapter 2 monologuing for minutes before he rides out on his bike from your palace like what? There's previous examples in this very game were you can just interrupt and attack people, but nah, just sit there and watch this shit eater leave.
What about the obvious trap of going to the planet for the "confrontation"? Why is there no option for you to not go, or set up some defense at home? Or anything really that isn't just follow the plot as the enemy set it up for you?
What about how you get captured? Like what? This ruins the whole point of the game. What the fuck? Diviners get no warning, biomancers just get knocked out by it, doesn't matter if you have a breathing device or whatever, it is just a story fail point where you get caught cause the devs want to send you somewhere else. Why wasn't this more of an elaborate plan? They could just do this at any point, why not do it in the throne room when you arrive and he monologues? Why not do it on the prison planet, or when they bait you with the planet of the other rogue trader? It just makes everything shit if it is this easy to capture you, the moron trader that goes in with no precautions or backup plans....
Next point on this, why do they need Yrliet outside of plot twist and drama? None of what they did to capture you requires her involvement. They could have just attacked one of your ships again and set the trap. Why not keep the original betrayer, it makes a character dumb and horrible for no reason outside "what a twist".
You get set up for a stupid interrogation with no point in plot outside of giving you more insight on the drukhari. If you give in or succeed and willpower your way through it, the result is the exact same, save for slightly different lines of dialogue.
Why the fuck does a Harlequin take interest and help you? Cause the devs thought it was cool to have one, then they made some bs up to justify it.
Should we talk about the Argenta twist? It makes no fucking sense that it was even possible. It isn't even consistent with the evidence in the room, it is stupid and makes no difference to you personally anyway, so why even use that as a twist? Just nonsensical bs.
None of the ecosystem in there makes sense, you get attacked on sight by all the guards, but then after you get patched up the guards are no longer hostile cause reasons. The Commisar and the Xeno shitbag existing and doing what they're doing makes no sense.
There's a lot of political nonsense between the experimenting shit bag and the other dark elf cunt that is just shit fluff. It isn't interesting, it isn't gone in to in depth and it kind of doesn't even matter if you read it since it doesn't change anything.
If you're in any way even a bit snarky to the dude that tortured you and your friends you just miss out on a whole companion, cause reasons.Marazhai is one of the worst things to exist as a character, his basically a cartoon villain and feels like someone's self insert that is for some reason ham-fisted as a potential companion... because who doesn't want the enemy that ruined his whole empire to be his sidekick now? Both he and Yrliet are dead in my playthrough and neither will ever not be dead in any of my playthroughs, because I find it nonsensical to act otherwise.
Now this bit is second hand knowledge and I'm not sure it is true, since I just kill her, but apparently they changed it from the beta to Yrliet was just told by the guy that her people are just there, but if that is true it makes it so much fucking worse. Cause why the fuck wouldn't she tell you were she got the info and just plays dumb? If she doesn't know it is a trap her actions make even less sense. For that matter, why do you not get a skill check to see through her bs, when she is so clearly hiding something and acting out of character? Cause you have to be captured.
You could have set it all up so much better.
The whole arena fights are naratively weak, especially so toward the end were they apparently want to kill you but not enough to just do it outright... despite the fact they attack you in the street before ... like what? And the whole escape is just silly.
What about the taking over as local boss and having that area as a ship replacemnt. You can give speaches and all that bs, none of those people come to help, you can't help them get out... it is all just hollow garbage.
Missed opportunities on dialogue with companions, not nearly enough is addressed and what is, is just boring.
Nothing was engaging about this whole act. It felt like a drag, wasting time with characters I didn't care for or liked, with a very contrived plot that pushed you one direction.
I mean design-wise even the whole place is a failure that doesn't really do justice to the Comorragh. It doesn't go dark enough in what happens, it is just a massive failure to me in every way.
Gameplay wise it is really bad. First of all you lose all gear and then have to reequip much later. You're alone and debilitated. Great set up to make for some interesting gameplay that makes you really immersed and feel the struggle. Nah, it is just filled with high dc checks despite you having massive negatives, you're given a pistol no matter what spec you are, almost anything you chose that isn't what the game wants from you is just an insta fail death.
You can't just start fights from a distance with a shot, cause not only do you always miss, unlike any other point in the game but obviously it doesn't even start the fight. The game punishes you for picking "the wrong" companions when you left your voidship, since if you, like me don't take argenta, you're then stuck with only Abelard until after the first arena fight, an ableard that has lowered stats himself and good luck having fun with that, you could try to just ignore RP and take yrliet for some extra bodies, but how much of a good RPG is that? Then you get Pasqal after the first arena fight and it gets a bit more bearable. Why the fuck are the NPCs in a pre-set order so you can fuck yourself without any way of knowing? Also it is easy to just lose abelard with no fault of your own.
The arena figts are boring slogs. They aren't interesting or fun in any way. It feels like they put no effort in it. In fact that is what this whole chapter feels like, few small areas with bland predictable characters that seem to do shit just cause the plot needs it, and constant samey fights that push traumas on you constantly with no pause between them.
The whole of Comorragh is badly done, but even its positioning in the story is shit. Why not capture you after they stole the sun? It would make so much more sense in every way. It would make more sense with the precarious situation you were already in, so you don't need stupid nonsense to get captured. It made much more sense pacing wise. This time around you barely just started to get in to rogue trading and upgrading your ship, exploring stuff, all fun, rogue trady things and you've finaly somewhat stabilized your area ... why do you take all that away and put me in this tiny little shit place? You just set up so many things and then just shove them asside for what feels like a fucking side quest.
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But this could have been handled better.
