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 Posted: Thu, 6th May 2010 13:10 Post subject: Positive Discrimination and the bending of values |
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You hear it alot: "A police officer sees a blackman running and looking dodgy and stops him to search him and id him, or the strangely behaving arab is stopped at the airport for an extra security check."
Usually this goes together with a big media circus how this is discriminating and wrong, but is this truly so and does it not happen all the time to everyone and not just the certain groups we hear all the time about.
Let me give an example : In the Netherlands we have something called "positive discrimination" which means they try to get women and "outsiders" into certain positions or try to stimulate them. In one case there was an open position of a high ranking police officer. There were 4 candidates of which 3 were Dutch males and 1 morrocan male. Two of the dutch males didnt not meet the requirements, but one fitted the requirements perfectly. The morrocan male did not meet all requirements and was hiding his previous engagements with the criminal world. He did get the job and in the end he only lasted 3 months after he was caught reengaging his criminal connections. Only then the best fitting person was allowed to get the job. How is this not discrimination as is clearly forbidden?
Another example: The Dutch tax system works on a basis of risk profiles. Certain people have a higher risk of trying to dodge taxes. One of those is the generally high earning white male. This risk profile is checked a few extra times in the automated system. Is this not exactly the same as stopping a shady looking person who has the high risk profile of a certain group?
There are many examples of this not limited to the obvious ones stated above and I wonder how we keep allowing this to happen. Choices must be made:
1. Either allow risk profiles to be but into practise and stop making a goddamn mess and racket about it.
2. Or block all generalisation and risk profiling for ALL people instead of those which are accepted by the general public.
The sad part is nobody brings this up in political circles, because the are scared of the political fallout that might have. Due to this fact people like Geert Wilders en Berlesconi can get into a position of power. Although they have foolish and unrealistic ideas and views they have the guts to touch these subjects. The society is not changing, it is the politicians who are lagging behind and not listening to what the people have to say.
I come to this because today I was denied a job of assisting a professor at my university, because they wanted to have someone who was more suited to stimulate the universities multicultural face. My Indian friend also got his internship at some shitty company denied because his background was "vague".
Some stereotypes are shunned while others are silently upheld by people in power. This is the very thing that breeds hate, misconceptions and misunderstandings between people who could in fact exist next to one another just fine.
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| Posted: Thu, 6th May 2010 13:28 Post subject: |
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The problem with your post is, it's based on assumptions and observations from your end. As a Turk living in Holland, I can guarantee you getting into any job is not made easy by being an immigrant. I can go into detail here and give examples, but since I doubt you'd care about the other side I won't bother.
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| Posted: Thu, 6th May 2010 13:31 Post subject: |
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| Mister_s wrote: | | The problem with your post is, it's based on assumptions and observations from your end. As a Turk living in Holland, I can guarantee you getting into any job is not made easy by being an immigrant. I can go into detail here and give examples, but since I doubt you'd care about the other side I won't bother. |
I never said I wasnt interested in your side of the story, also do note that I obviously state that it should not be done on either side of the coin, for the coin is one.
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| Posted: Thu, 6th May 2010 13:37 Post subject: |
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I can base my opinion only on my observations, just like you do. Discussing such a thing is impossible. How can you keep objective statistics for something like positive discrimination? I'm a high educated Turk who was born here, so I won;t bitch about how difficult it is. I speak the language better than most Dutch people and in the academical world no one gives a shit about your heritage. I do have family and friends who are not as lucky as me, I can guarantee you it's not as easy as you seem to think. Discrimination, whether it's done willingly or not, will always be present. Would you cry discrimination too if a boss hired his friend over a better qualified person? Whether it's skin color, ethnic heritage or just some bullshit excuse, 'discrimination' is inevitable.
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| Posted: Thu, 6th May 2010 13:56 Post subject: |
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| Mister_s wrote: | | I can base my opinion only on my observations, just like you do. Discussing such a thing is impossible. How can you keep objective statistics for something like positive discrimination? I'm a high educated Turk who was born here, so I won;t bitch about how difficult it is. I speak the language better than most Dutch people and in the academical world no one gives a shit about your heritage. I do have family and friends who are not as lucky as me, I can guarantee you it's not as easy as you seem to think. Discrimination, whether it's done willingly or not, will always be present. Would you cry discrimination too if a boss hired his friend over a better qualified person? Whether it's skin color, ethnic heritage or just some bullshit excuse, 'discrimination' is inevitable. |
My point beeing that its total bullshit when a running blackman is held for inspection a social outrage occurs, but when it happens less obviously everybody lets it pass. There are simply so many hypocrites who simply abuse this.
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adastar
Posts: 288
Location: Occupied CSA, North America
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| Posted: Thu, 6th May 2010 14:43 Post subject: |
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this is called affirmative action in america, the majority of all government jobs are filled by so called "minorities(black,mexicans) who are in reality not qualified. Just about every day now there are lawsuits filed because whites and sometimes even Asians are being passed over for an under qualified minority.
Some police forces and fireman have even begun eliminating their entrance exams because minorities could not pass them, which has led to under qualified services from these divisions which will most likely lead to deaths.
The worst thing you can be in america right now is being a white Christian male. I guess the saving grace is when we become the minorities we will get the same privileges such as black only scholarships, tv stations, monuments, and everything else. But most likely we will go the way of south africa, continue to be murdered and raped everyday till we end up in zoos as a endangered species.
In conclusion affirmative action helps NO ONE. It does not help the economy, it does not help productivity and it sure as hell doesnt make people trust the government when their employees cant even figure out how to use a fucking stapler!
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adastar
Posts: 288
Location: Occupied CSA, North America
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| Posted: Thu, 6th May 2010 16:48 Post subject: |
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I have two Turkish parents, so that makes me a Turk. What you're talking about is assimilation, not integration.
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TSR69
Banned
Posts: 14962
Location: Republic of the Seven United Provinces
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| Posted: Thu, 6th May 2010 16:50 Post subject: |
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We have had this discussion before but I would suggest you would call yourself Dutch with a Turkish cultural background.
Formerly known as iconized
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adastar
Posts: 288
Location: Occupied CSA, North America
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| Posted: Thu, 6th May 2010 17:28 Post subject: |
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| Mister_s wrote: | | I have two Turkish parents, so that makes me a Turk. What you're talking about is assimilation, not integration. |
ok if its assimilation then, why are you doing it? That is why so many people have issues with immigrants, you move to another country and then refuse to become a part of it. If you like turkey so much move back
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| Posted: Thu, 6th May 2010 17:59 Post subject: |
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Why would I assimilate? Does living in a country require becoming a native? I like my Turkish heritage, I don't have to give it up. There are enough Germans, Italians and Spaniards here, no one's asking them to assimilate. I'm more part of this country than a 'native' who doesn't do shit but magically deserves more because he was born here.
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adastar
Posts: 288
Location: Occupied CSA, North America
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| Posted: Thu, 6th May 2010 18:43 Post subject: |
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Theres a difference between a European in another European country and some guy who's family comes from a nation Europe has sacrificed thousands of people fighting over the centuries to keep it out.
Yes a native whos line goes back hundreds of years in a country does deserve to be there more then you. Why the fuck do you move to a country if you dont want to become a part of it? Welfare? Once again, if turkey is so great that its values and ideas belong in europe, WHY DID YOUR FAMILY MOVE.
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nouseforaname
Über-VIP Member
Posts: 21306
Location: Toronto, Canada
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| Posted: Thu, 6th May 2010 18:51 Post subject: |
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when did nfohump turn into stormfront.org?
asus z170-A || core i5-6600K || geforce gtx 970 4gb || 16gb ddr4 ram || win10 || 1080p led samsung 27"
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| Posted: Thu, 6th May 2010 19:08 Post subject: |
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| nouseforaname wrote: | | when did nfohump turn into stormfront.org? |
Jesus for fuck sake, stop bending my words into a race hating war and read what it says ffs.
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Lutzifer
Modzilla
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| Posted: Thu, 6th May 2010 19:11 Post subject: |
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locked, see the other anti-immigration thread in the general forum for reasoning
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