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chiv
Posts: 27530
Location: Behind You...
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 Posted: Tue, 3rd Jun 2014 10:14 Post subject: |
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| VGAdeadcafe wrote: | | The story was anti-cod, that doesn't make it |
No one said anything anti cod is automatically good, only that anyone suggesting that they were similar games (or that spec ops was similar to any of its ilk) is quite simply wrong in their understanding of the game (and that IS fact, not opinion) |
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| Posted: Tue, 3rd Jun 2014 10:41 Post subject: |
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| chiv wrote: |
Because it didn't glorify war... It's about as anti cod as you can get, because it was a dark story about the deconstruction of the main character, where his gung-ho rah rah cod-style mentality essentially destroys everything around him.
The fact you compared it to GOW leads me to suspect you got bored of - and switched off to - the story at a very early point in the game, so it's not surprising you didn't think much of it, because without the narrative, all you're really left with is a handful of cool songs and some very generic combat. |
ah ok that makes sense. yeah i did follow the story that but it just didn't strike the right cords for me. I guess it could be since the core of the game still is gears of war combat.
Or to paraphrase, i just don't see a gears of war type of shooting game being a good medium for an anti war game. you are still getting dopamine from combat. I don't think anti war, and "yeah killed the last guy, finally a checkpoint" are a good combo.
But obviously the game did something right seeing how many here praise it, even if I didn't feel it.
I think i am just unphased by war games in general at this point in life, and the anti war messages are so ingrained inside me that I don't really need any more anti war warm and fuzzy feelings from any medium.
there are parts of the world where they still don't get this though, but too bad this game won't reach the majorty of such people.
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| Posted: Tue, 3rd Jun 2014 10:51 Post subject: |
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| Drowning_witch wrote: | | chiv wrote: |
Because it didn't glorify war... It's about as anti cod as you can get, because it was a dark story about the deconstruction of the main character, where his gung-ho rah rah cod-style mentality essentially destroys everything around him.
The fact you compared it to GOW leads me to suspect you got bored of - and switched off to - the story at a very early point in the game, so it's not surprising you didn't think much of it, because without the narrative, all you're really left with is a handful of cool songs and some very generic combat. |
ah ok that makes sense. yeah i did follow the story that but it just didn't strike the right cords for me. I guess it could be since the core of the game still is gears of war combat.
Or to paraphrase, i just don't see a gears of war type of shooting game being a good medium for an anti war game. you are still getting dopamine from combat. I don't think anti war, and "yeah killed the last guy, finally a checkpoint" are a good combo.
But obviously the game did something right seeing how many here praise it, even if I didn't feel it.
I think i am just unphased by war games in general at this point in life, and the anti war messages are so ingrained inside me that I don't really need any more anti war warm and fuzzy feelings from any medium.
there are parts of the world where they still don't get this though, but too bad this game won't reach the majorty of such people. |
you only played the first ACT ... later on it becomes a non-linear game with game choices that will show how retarded war is and war games are... and the main hero knows this
and its 5 endings this game has just blow you away |
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chiv
Posts: 27530
Location: Behind You...
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| Posted: Tue, 3rd Jun 2014 10:58 Post subject: |
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| Drowning_witch wrote: | | ....Or to paraphrase, i just don't see a gears of war type of shooting game being a good medium for an anti war game. you are still getting dopamine from combat. I don't think anti war, and "yeah killed the last guy, finally a checkpoint" are a good combo. |
Spoilers... Obviously....
That was part of it though, it was quite intentional, like the white phosphorus sequence where you're so conditioned to get that little hit of pleasure and reward wiping those little white blips off the screen, only to find out afterwards that you've basically committed a war crime while you were having "fun". I guess for a lot of people who enjoyed the game, that scene stopped them dead and made them go... fuck...
For everyone else, they just shrugged and kept playing, not giving any time or thought to actually thinking about what happened, why it happened, and if they were comfortable with their actions (even though from a gameplay point you ultimately HAD no choice, the fact you weren't likely thinking about any consequences while you were doing it, a the main point)
There was also other stuff, like choosing (or not) to kill civilians in anger, etc... It's all designed to make you consider your actions based on emotions.
NOT saying you're wrong for not "feeling it" or anything, I think art and media is up to how much we personally get out of it. I personally got quite a powerful emotional hit out of it.. Others didn't, because it just didn't strike a chord with them.
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| Posted: Tue, 3rd Jun 2014 12:43 Post subject: |
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This game is refreshing for people who doesn't read books in general. Because the story it self and it's arc are nothing new. Read a book or two and you will recognize the story or the "heart".
The gameplay in this game is just as bad as any cod if not worse. If they just nailed the gunplay i'd give it a much higher value.
Only reason i'm giving this a 6 instead of 4 is because of Conrads story.
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| Posted: Wed, 4th Jun 2014 03:51 Post subject: |
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| Hfric wrote: |
you only played the first ACT ... later on it becomes a non-linear game with game choices that will show how retarded war is and war games are... and the main hero knows this
and its 5 endings this game has just blow you away |
I played the whole game man. I saw 2-3 differnet endings, can't recall.
I jsut wasn't blown away by the anti war sentiment. but yeah, if it had an impact on you guys, then I can't deny its real.
| chiv wrote: |
Spoilers... Obviously....
That was part of it though, it was quite intentional, like the white phosphorus sequence where you're so conditioned to get that little hit of pleasure and reward wiping those little white blips off the screen, only to find out afterwards that you've basically committed a war crime while you were having "fun". I guess for a lot of people who enjoyed the game, that scene stopped them dead and made them go... fuck...
For everyone else, they just shrugged and kept playing, not giving any time or thought to actually thinking about what happened, why it happened, and if they were comfortable with their actions (even though from a gameplay point you ultimately HAD no choice, the fact you weren't likely thinking about any consequences while you were doing it, a the main point)
There was also other stuff, like choosing (or not) to kill civilians in anger, etc... It's all designed to make you consider your actions based on emotions.
NOT saying you're wrong for not "feeling it" or anything, I think art and media is up to how much we personally get out of it. I personally got quite a powerful emotional hit out of it.. Others didn't, because it just didn't strike a chord with them. |
All valid points and glad to see that games do have such an impact on other people. It just wasn't this game for me.
I do think that nforules is right to a degree. Your past experiences do define how a game affects you. I dabbled in philosophy and literature in hgihschool early college days, so I guess that could be the reason that this anti war sentiment hasn't affected me that much. I've seen stuff like that many times, and I guess i'm desensitized to the topic. |
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prudislav
VIP Member
Posts: 29148
Location: The land of beer and porn
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| Posted: Tue, 22nd Jul 2014 00:51 Post subject: |
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http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showthread.php?t=858925
| Quote: | No Chance for Spec Ops: The Line 2
- Yager had to learn a tough lesson with their anti-war game Spec Ops: The line: Gamers demand smart games yet they buy Call of Duty. Our interview with the team reveals what that means for their future.
- Yager used the phrase "optimistic war" in a recent presentation of their new space shooter Dreadnought. No blood, no bodies, no dead women and children. Dreadnought should be about fun, clearly distancing itself from Spec Ops
- It is implied that Yager has to distance itself from Spec Ops as it was a financial flop. Otherwise negotiations with publishers over new titles would have become too difficult
- Spec Ops was in development hell for over 5 years
- Managing Director Timo Ullman states that Yager will probably not work on any military style shooter again. By his own admission: "If you can't compete with the big ones, the risk is too big. The market for "smart" or "intellectual" games is too niche. Elitist almost."
- Art Director Mathias Wiese admits he is happy to work on other settings now. Working on Spec Ops was mentally exhausting. "You can imagine what kind of reference material you have to review [for a game like Spec Ops]. That's not fun. You're happy when you can do something else after that "
- Nevertheless, Yager is proud of Spec Ops as it helped raise their profile in the industry |
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| Posted: Tue, 22nd Jul 2014 00:56 Post subject: |
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Last edited by Interinactive on Tue, 5th Oct 2021 01:55; edited 1 time in total
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| Posted: Tue, 22nd Jul 2014 00:59 Post subject: |
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Man, I was playing this game 2 years ago at exact time. And it was an amazing deep experience. It was even warmer then so I was actually sweating like characters in game. This is one of few games I feel like playing in summer.
3080 | ps5 pro
Sin317-"im 31 years old and still surprised at how much shit comes out of my ass actually ..."
SteamDRM-"Call of Duty is the symbol of the true perfection in every aspect. Call of Duty games are like Mozart's/Beethoven's symphonies"
deadpoetic-"are you new to the cyberspace?"
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| Posted: Tue, 22nd Jul 2014 06:05 Post subject: |
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They don't honestly think that the game failed because it was "anti-war" or "smart", do they?
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| Posted: Tue, 22nd Jul 2014 06:13 Post subject: |
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Last edited by Interinactive on Tue, 5th Oct 2021 01:55; edited 1 time in total
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| Posted: Tue, 22nd Jul 2014 16:30 Post subject: |
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| Interinactive wrote: | If it was up to me, I wouldn't have made the game as they had. Why'd it even have to be a shooter? You can't glorify war and then unglorify it any other way than by jumping between chest high walls and shooting? What about a war photographer trying to escape a war zone? A man with a child trying to get out? From the point of view of a refugee?
Some people might say that those ideas might not have sold well. Well, neither did theirs, but presenting their ideas through a game like Fahrenheit, LA Noire, or even a freaking Telltale game would have been much more effective IMO. And cheaper. They chose the most generic fucking idea out there and ran with it. And I'm almost glad that it turned out this way. |
Actually I think that making it a shooter was a good idea, especially if it had some familiarity with the well-know shooters. They kinda make you run through all of it in a seemingly typical "America, F-Yeah!" scenario, and then just grab you and say "Now look at what you have done." That way it isn't just about war, but about how war is portrayed in games.
It's just a shame it wasn't a good shooter. Would have delivered a much better message in the end if you actually enjoyed shooting all the shit up as well.
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| Posted: Tue, 22nd Jul 2014 16:39 Post subject: |
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Yeah, Looks like I wasn't alone in the sentiment that their choices for an antiwar game were bad.
Look at Valiant hearts on how to make a proper war game where you mix the "feel good" feels with the futility and destruction of war. A gears of war with sand was just not the wisest choice, imo.
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| Posted: Tue, 22nd Jul 2014 16:43 Post subject: |
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I'm completely with Snifty on this, I like that it plays out as a typical war "game" and then, only at the end, are you hit with the reality of what you've done and what you've been a part of. It was far more powerful than way, more brutal, than just "surviving" through the horrors of war.
I also agree that the lacklustre combat/gameplay itself could have been so much better.
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| Posted: Mon, 2nd Mar 2015 02:44 Post subject: |
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Good read
http://www.ign.com/articles/2012/07/20/the-story-secrets-of-spec-ops-the-line
| Quote: | | “In chapter one, Konrad's face appears on the billboard,” Williams explains. “In chapter five, Konrad's face appears on a very large billboard that changes when you go around a corner. Nobody noticed that change happening.” |
| Quote: | | There are a lot of pictures of people with their eyes blacked out in the first half of the game,” says Williams. “You'll notice that those eyes are only blacked out in situations where there's something truly horrible in the area. They are literally closing their eyes to the reality in front of them.” Later, Williams explains, “there's a tree covered in leaves that, after you pass, if you look back, the tree is now dead, the leaves have completely vanished.” |
Particularly this:
| Quote: | | Williams notes one last, vital visual trick. "Any time the game is doing a normal transition, it'll fade to black. Any time Walker is hallucinating, or lying to himself, in a kind of delusional fashion, the game will fade to white," he says. "The entire epilogue sequence where Walker goes home, it fades to white. Even if you are not reading that Walker died in the chopper crash, it is meant to be understood that Walker is hallucinating going home." |
Come on Yager: Spec Ops: The Line 2 - make it happen!
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| Posted: Mon, 2nd Mar 2015 11:12 Post subject: |
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| Posted: Mon, 2nd Mar 2015 17:44 Post subject: |
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Yea, but in this day and age of war/conflict shooters like COD etc, I think devs could actually learn a lot from games such as this, despite it not really having very great or innovative gameplay.
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| Posted: Tue, 3rd Mar 2015 17:57 Post subject: |
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I never finished act one when this came out, hated it cause it was yet another UE third person shooter but am intrigued cause people say it has a good story later on.
I can't get past intro screen tho. I get a several "filename not found" messages on a crash dialog. Anyone know how to fix this? Google didn't help. Update 2 installed.
Asus, B550, 3700X, 3060, 32GB.
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briangw
Posts: 1754
Location: Warren, MN
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| Posted: Fri, 14th Feb 2020 15:22 Post subject: |
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https://www.pcgamesn.com/the-cycle/epic-exclusivity-steam
best quote in there: "I did not expect the reaction to be that strong"
The fuck you didn't. These people can't be that clueless.....unless you've been living under a rock, there's been "strong reaction" ever since the exclusive bullshit started with Epic Games.
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| Posted: Fri, 14th Feb 2020 18:32 Post subject: |
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Well, this says it all about this fuckers:
"The developer will be aided by fresh investment from the Chinese conglomerate Tencent."
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ixigia
[Moderator] Consigliere
Posts: 65126
Location: Italy
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| Posted: Fri, 14th Feb 2020 19:23 Post subject: |
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Yeah, aside from the usual pointle$$ drivel and vile rhetorics when Epic is involved, their battle royale shooter designed for pre-teens truly looks abysmal.  
Spec Ops: The Line was in my opinion a very mediocre experience, but at least it had an interesting/unique narrative structure that could partially redeem it. That new project on the other hand..god damn.
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| Posted: Wed, 11th Jan 2023 15:17 Post subject: |
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Just finished this. I've held it off for way too long. Well, it was pretty good. Gameplay being gears of war was a bit of a chore. "Gee, wonder if this open area with a thousand hindrances will end up with a gunfight"...
The way the story got darker and darker was just fantastic. YET! One thing i cannot get behind is how everyone always blamed Walker. I mean, your team is being shot left and right at first contact, always. Never given much choice at all, and then you're the bad guy? Your team start blaming Walker too, but they're just drama queens. Not offering any helpful solutions, just complaining. If it was up to them, you'd just up and die
No one even attempts to explain or bring you over to their side, just shoot and talk drivel.
Well, except for that it was fantastic.
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